CERT - is it worth it?

CERT
Of course, I imagine your results may vary depending on who's running the org in your area, but is the basic program worthy of looking into? Who here has done/is doing it?

I've thought about getting the training, but haven't yet. Interested to hear from those that have

I don't know if it is universal like the CERT curriculum, but I'm in the middle of an 8-week program called the Community Emergency Preparedness Academy (CEPA). Our city sponsors CEPA while other neighboring jurisdictions have the traditional CERT programs. I've never taken a CERT course, but the curriculum overlaps signficantly with CEPA so my comments probably apply to both.

I would say that if you are already preparedness-minded and have already educated yourself about various topics, much of the information in CERT training could be quite basic for you. Of course, some speakers are much more interesting than others, so even basic information can be presented in an interesting way. However, beyond just the information, there is no substitute for actually doing certain things.

For example, we just had CPR with AED training last week. It's been 15 years since I pounded on one of those CPR dummies, so I think the practice was well worth it. I also have never gotten any hands-on time with an AED, so that was a good thing for me. One other hands-on thing so far was practicing with dry chem extinguishers which was also kind of fun.

CEPA has made me more aware of the various public safety agencies around me because these are the folks leading many of the lectures. Before now, I really never had much contact with law enforcement or fire folks around here, but we also have lectures from people from the local hospital, the Red Cross, or reps from the local utility companies. Plus, I've met some nice fellow residents, so I look forward to the weekly classes.

We have a couple families and I think that's wonderful. There's one woman and her two teenage kids who come every week. I think that sets a great example for the next generation.

I heard CERT mentioned on the local news the other day. The first time I think I've ever heard the word mentioned on TV, actually. During our first Santa Ana winds of the season, there was the Sesno fire near the Porter Ranch gated community. The fire started mid-morning, so lot's of folks were hurrying back from work to go home and grab stuff but the authorities did no want any vehicles going back into the community. So the folks standing out in the roadway at the main gate telling people that they couldn't drive back inside were CERT volunteers and the news reporter actually mentioned it. I thought that was pretty cool, but only viewers who had any idea what CERT was would have any clue what that meant.

Oh, if you're wondering why there is a CEPA and a CERT program, I learned that one main goal of CERT is to create a reserve corp of residents who can assist first responders in times of need. CEPA is more about educating people to be able to take care of themselves and their neighbors when public services are swamped, so we get most of the same training as CERT, but we aren't going to be "called up" after an earthquake to help search a neighborhood or whatever other million things that CERT folks might assist with. We're just ordinary folks who have had some disaster preparedness training.

My understanding of CERT vs CEPA is the same as Arney's. Its all good. I took the first CERT class in a town where the fire department doesn't have any immediate plans to integrate CERT teams into their response plans - not that I blame them, until we build a critical mass of CERT trained folks who stay interested and maintain / extend our training I wouldn't want to rely on us either. Until then, we act mainly as CEPA, taking care of our friends and family with a bit more training on the basics. CERT in California I understand is totally different - plenty of volunteers, a high level of organization, and they are highly motivated to take part in training necessary to rely on them in disaster scenarios. CERT has some history with Northridge, Loma Prieta etc.

CERT training did springboard me into training for Red Cross shelter work, which got me interested in emergency management, and I'm interested in pursuing a master's degree in that now, in middle age. I've extended my first aid training to a level of comfort with the types of injuries I'll encounter. I became a ham to improve my chances of communicating. Its always better to have folks know what to expect in a disaster, whether its a hazmat release, winter storm, tornado or earthquake. Your own piece of mind should go up if you go through CERT, along with your general preparedness.

I took the 11 week course offered in NY City. It is specifically geared to NYC, with its urban environment and accompanying infrastructure. Topics included hazards associated with public transportation (trains, bridges, etc.), high-rise buildings, and public venues. I feel that the training was worthwhile.

I took the training a year ago and really liked it. It' a lot of really good background info and it's a good connection to the local EMS. The biggest benefit I've found is when talking to people about preparedness. If you just say "I'm preparing for an unknown emergency" people think you're weird. If you say "I took Community Emergency Response Team training from the local fire department." people are much more open to talk.

Very good point.
I was supposed to start CERT training last month but the classes were put on hold until the damages of hurricane Ike have repaired.

-Blast

That sucks. This would be the perfect time to start a class, the reason for the training would be in everyone's mind.

I'm a CERT instructor, and what is covered is Basic First Aid and Triage, Light Search and Rescue, Basic Firefighting, and basic Emergency Preparedness. Also included is a coverage of Terrorism, Hazardous Materials, Disaster Psychology, Incident Command System and Administrative procedures.

After seeing gryps post, perhaps I should mosey down to NYC for those specific NYC classes and see what I can learn.

Questions:

If a CERT Team member is injured while providing assistance during an event, who covers their medical and or disability expenses? If a CERT Team member is injured or disabled and is unable to work, do they have some sort of legal protection from being discharged from their place of employment?

Our county looked at participating in Fire Corp., a citizen based organization similar to CERT, which provides non-hazardous support to fire companies. However, when the County Risk Manager looked at the liability the county would have to assume, the county decided not to pursue participation.

Pete

That is a great question.

The application for the CERT here states explicitly that the City is non-liable and all activities are at my risk.
Classes start next week.

I too am in favor of CERT training. If nothing else it is an excellent springboard to start family discussions about preparedness....and can be a whole lot more.

The training in my view is quite basic and more of an introduction to the specific skills, but it can and should lead to increased involvement in the community.

My wife and I did CERT in 2002 which lead to our joining the local RACES/CERT groups and continuing on with monthly training.

Hey thanks for the info. I emailed a local contact in my city to see when the next classes start in my town.

In Florida and Connecticut, if you are "activated", you are covered. From my understanding "activated" is defined by the SOP for your sponsoring organization. For example, here in CT, we can't "self-deploy". But, it does seem possible that an EM can create rules that say "after a tornado has passed, CERT teams should activate and check in as soon as possible". That way, you can help, you're legally "activated" by SOP. The training keeps pounding into your head "keep yourself safe", so if you actually do get injured, I wonder if you'll be able to recover anything.

Currently from my understanding, only a few places specifically protect disaster volunteers.

This is not legal advice, although I am a lawyer.

Very generally speaking, officially FEDERALLY activated "intermittent disaster responders," Such as Disaster Medical Assistance Team members, fall under the job protections provided by USERRA (Uniformed Services Employment and Reemployment Rights Act), but are without disability coverage. They are also protected from civil liability under the FTCA (Federal Tort Claims Act).

Unless your state has specific legislation on the topic, I'd guess that you are most likely NOT provided disability, liability or employment protections. But you MAY have some liability protection under your state's version of a "Good Samaritan" law, or not. These state laws vary widely.

Also, be aware that participating in any sort of organized rescue group, whether paid or volunteer, MAY cause you to be excluded from your personal medical, liability and/or disability insurance coverage.

Again, this is offered only for general discussion. Consult an attorney familiar with your jurisdiction's laws for specific information and legal advice.

Jeff

Is the coverage through the state, county or city municipalities? Under what insurance program are you covered i.e. state or local workman’s compensation, separate government health/disability insurance plan?

Pete

Jeff, some excellent advice.

My questions were not for me specifically, but more rhetorical in nature, since I do not believe the CERT system has been “tested” by a legal challenge through a significant injury or death and what the aftermath of a medical, disability or death claim may hold for the individual and/or family of the CERT member.

Generally, “Good Samaritan Laws” are there to protect the “provider” of medical care. It generally protects the “provider” from civil and/or criminal prosecution, requiring the individual providing the care not to exceed their level/scope of training/practice, “do no harm” and not abandon patient care unless safety issues prevent further care or a higher level provide assumes control.

For myself, here in Frederick County, MD, all 1st responders (Fire/Rescue/EMS and Fire/Auxiliary Police), career or volunteer are covered for injury, disability or LODD through the county’s Workman’s Compensation Insurance plan. That is why all volunteers must be current members of a fire company and are legally viewed as county employees, allowing them to be covered by the county's insurance plan. In fact all volunteers are eligible (Spec Ops Team members are required) to undergo the same comprehensive annual physical that career personnel receive each year.

Pete

Pete raises a VERY important issue, particularly from a volunteer's perspective If Jeff's point about being excluded from a volunteer's personal insurance does end up applying to someone, and if things like training, SOP's, and signing a "hold harmless" agreement protects the sponsoring organization from liability, then a volunteer who is injured/killed seems to be on their own for any costs.

Which seems unfair, when I think of the implications. Someone makes the effort to volunteer, go through training and whatnot, then steps on a rusty nail while searching tornado-damaged homes as a CERT, and their personal medical insurance could decline to pay the medical bill if they're aware that it was during a CERT activation. On the other hand, Joe the Plumber could be doing "whatever" after the tornado, gets hurt, and is covered by his insurance as a private citizen.

I am a CERT instructor for our fire department. The basic 20 hour course is a good introduction to what a family can do in a major disaster. It is designed for the urban setting.
The Community Emergency Response Team (CERT) Program educates people about disaster preparedness for hazards that may impact their area and trains them in basic disaster response skills, such as fire safety, light search and rescue, team organization, and disaster medical operations. Using the training learned in the classroom and during exercises, CERT members can assist others in their neighborhood or workplace following an event when professional responders are not immediately available to help. CERT members also are encouraged to support emergency response agencies by taking a more active role in emergency preparedness projects in their community.

The CERT manuals are available for download from the www.fema.gov site.

In California, you can only self activate after a major earthquake and there is visible damage. When you sign in at your designated meeting place, you are covered from any injury to get while doing CERT function under the California Disabilities Act (the state pays).

My insurance says that I should be covered, but would try to seek compensation from the organization. Good luck with that : p

I do not know any details about the insurance and what not. Except for the following information:

CT Statues: Title 28, Section 14 - Compensation for death, disability or injury

Perhaps I should find out for myself... I also am a volunteer for a specific city, so, it's possible that I would only be protected under the city workman's compensation coverage.

I joined CERT in our community in the Seattle area. The training included light search and rescue I knew nothing about, and how to organize others, and actual practice extinguishing fires and with a simulated disaster. We do not have a critical mass yet, so in a major disaster are expected to stay put and if our family is OK, organize our neighbors for self-help. I was very pleased with the training and think it would make all the difference in my attitude in a major disaster--in the PNW read earthquake with no warning or advance preparation time like with a hurricane. Not standing around wondering what to do wishing the government was there to help, and at least feeling like I knew how to get my neighbors working together to help ourselves. I never asked about the injury thing because there was so much emphasis on identifying and avoiding potential injury situations that I did not think about the chance of being injured nontheless.

There's 28 people in this class that I am in, with more interested in attending the next. It's being given by the director of the emergency services for this area and seems to be a revival of lapsed CERT for this county.

I just finished the 8 week CEPA program I wrote about earlier. The certificate of completion is sitting on my desk in front of me now. I'm normally not that sentimental about stuff but looking at that certificate actually puts a little smile on my face. Partly, it's knowing that I was doing something that may help me, my family, and neighbors, but I guess I also smile because I genuinely enjoyed going through the course and enjoyed meeting the other people every week. We had all ages, from teenagers to folks in their golden years, various knowledge levels from could-teach-this-course to never-thought-of-preparedness-before types. I think there's something of value in it for everyone.

So, going back to the original question of whether CERT (or CEPA) training is worth attending, I would definitely say, "Yes".

thanks to cutbacks, my city has discontinued the program.