Carrying survival gear for more than one person.

I've always thought that in a survival or even just a run-of-the-mill camping situation, it's probably a good idea to make friends and that sharing is a good thing, so I've tried to plan my gear kits around the idea that I may run into another person that may need help or can provide help, or just good company. The general idea is that I always try to carry enough gear for two adults where it's not too cumbersome.

For instance, I like to carry enough cooking and eating gear so that I can share with a trailmate. Two knives, two forks, two spoons, two sporks, two cups, two bowls, two plates. Some of it is titanium for the weight savings (I *love* the Snow Peak titanium utensils and cups), and some is stainless (MSR plates and bowls).

In my urban kits, I always pack an extra set of safety glasses, dust masks, and nitrile gloves, among other things.

I also take two tarps along. Two tarps can make a pretty secure shelter, or two simple shelters (or whatever you might find a need for that a tarp can accomplish).

I'm curious if others out there follow a similar philosophy. Obviously, I don't do this where it's going to create a serious weight problem. I'm not an ultralight kind of guy, except in the sense that I don't go crazy trying to bring my whole house on my back. It's just that a little friendship and hospitality at the right time can go a long way. It also means I always have spares.

I tend to do the same thing. My sister and brother don't carry much (my sister is one of the unbelieving). But my best friend carries extra stuff like I do.

It's one thing to think other people should be prepared, but you've got to be pretty hardboiled to sit under your tarp, cooking your soup, chewing your jerky with your woolly hat and mittens while your friend sits shivering in the cold rain.

And if anyone asks where to draw the line... only you can answer that.

Sue

Yeah, for over two years I carried spare gear to cover my hiking buddy. He always planned get stuff but "just never got around to it". But I like him enough to keep him alive.

Anyway, after "hints" to his wife about some of the dangers we've encountered out in the wilds she got a gear list from me and gave him all of it for Christmas. That made everybody happy.

-Blast

Nice! Could you share that list? I'm impressed that it was so gladly approved by your friend's wife.

Off the top of my head:

50' paracord...$2
1st aid kit...$8
LED flashlight...$7
Silva starter compass...$9
pealess whistle (that took some explaining)...$3
Spark-lite...$10
Steel signal mirror...$3
Leatherman Wave...$60?
Eureka bivysack...$70
Micropur MP 1 water purification pellets...$10
pocket survival book...$10

I know, I should have told her about the Ritter PSK! I didn't think she'd get any of the stuff let alone all the stuff!

-Blast

The one thing I always carry extra of is water. It seems like every other time out I share water with someone who has run out.

I hate it because it is probably the heaviest thing I have to carry. Depending on where I am going and doing, I usually carry 2-4 liters of water and sometimes up to 6 if it is long and strenous. Some hikes just don't afford you a chance to replenish because there is no source of water on the trail.

When doing outdoors activites I carry an extra knife (Alox SAK) and extra fire-starting method (usually a mini-bic) for the purpose of letting someone else use them (or giving to them). In my experience those are the two most common things people ask to borrow. Other than that I don't like to loan stuff out. Carrying a bunch of everything is just too much weight.

I always pack my survival kit with some redundancy in mind but I don't deliberately carry all the gear for my companions. I also don't think it would be fair to me. The gear should be every individual's responsibility and if somebody neglects it, that's his own fault really.

The only exception would be heavier items like shelter tarps or cooking utensils. We usually distribute those so that everyone carries something according to their strength and physical abilities.

In my Jeep I generally Keep 1 extra set of clothing (rain / cold weather gear included) as well as a few tarps, wool blanket, sleeping bag, several knives, lighters, flashlights etc. All of this is in addition to what I plan on needing for the trip. Officially I carry these as personal backups, but I find that I am normally prepared enough not to need them. Thus I normally end up loaning my redundant gear out to my friends.

My friends tend to be rather ill-equipped on our outings. Lately I've been packing a few additional items which are slightly more PHRASECENSOREDPOSTERSHOULDKNOWBETTER. friendly. For example I now keep a spare folder in my Jeep to loan out in addition to my emergency Ka-Bar. I like to save the day and help out my friends, makes me feel like a hero

On my last outing, one of the tents was not pitched properly and the occupants got wet during the night. The next morning, when I found out, I asked if they were ok, and if there was anything I could do. She said her gear was soaked, but doubted I could do anything about it. I responded by pulling a full set of Gore-Tex rain gear out of the back of my Jeep. The expression on her face was priceless

Interesting philosophy, and one that runs counter to much of what you'll see discussed here. A lot of people, myself included, prefer solitude while hiking or hunting, and concentrate more on how to avoid strangers. So while I will make provisions for supplying an under-equipped buddy, I'm not going to go out of my way to approach a stranger unless they are obviously in distress. Of course, if someone asks me for help they'll likely get it.

I carry enough plus a very little bit more. I try not to hike where the tourists go for many reasons.

If my regular hiking companions were to not carry their share I'd accept that ONCE. And we'd have a talk. And if it didn't change we'd not be regular companions any more. That's the plus side to their not being relatives!

Once upon a time I decided to not hike anymore with a fellow who had gone on several outings with me and my other buddies but who scared me for his lack of awareness. He wasn't a full participant and couldn't save me if I needed help (couldn't even find the car when spot-checked!). He understood and later took some Sierra Club courses, worked up to Trip Leader, and then had to spend an unexpected night out. :-)

Only gear I've really loaned on the trail was in Rocky Mtn Nat'l Park when a solo individual from N. Carolina described being really confused on top of the tundra where he was doing cross-country camping zones. He'd left his compass at home. I loaned him mine because my buddy had his. (He mailed it back later)

unimogbert

I would loan stuff to my brother, but he usually out-gears me. Other than that, no I don't. Carry stuff for other people capable of carrying their own? No frakkin' way. If someone needs water bad enough for me to give it to them, then my hike just turned into a rescue.

I am all for helping someone it trouble, but if I played with the same group a lot, and the same people were always underequipped and wanting to use my stuff, I would come to the conclusion that they were using me ("I won't worry about buying one of those, OBG will let me use his again"). If we are talking about a built in air compressor I might have in my jeep or something that is one thing, but smaller, less expensive, must have stuff (eating gear, compass, knife, first aid kit {ala Jon Dorn of Backpacker Magazine}), after the second time we would be having a talk. If I can bring two of something, they can sure bring one...

I do not carry extra gear for others. When all is said and done, it is heavy enough to carry what you have for yourself. That is not to say that I could not improvise with what I had to assist others.

I did, however, have a "Guest BOB" at my house for some time. Now it has been converted into a kid's supplies BOB that an adult would carry for my kids. The guest stuff has made way for more baby clothes, wipes, diapers, and water now that I have a 2 month old in the house. It could be and still is a minimal "Guest BOB", but the guest needs to know that the primary reason for the bag is supplies for my children, which the guest obviously can't use anyway. My 2 year old has her own BOB with 1 Daltrex 2400 ration, .5liter of water, change of clothes, wistle, poncho, mylar blanket and a couple toys, but she still can't even carry it on her own. She is indeed quite skilled with a flashlight and can turn on basically any push-button flashlight and knows how to point and where not to (aka in the eyes). But back on topic-

Although I prefer and am better suited to bug-in, a bug-out situation could occur when you have company visiting, so my philosophy is that it is always best to have some supplies that they can take with them. Granted, I take a personal kit with me wherever I go, which supplements my EDC, but others do not carry around a BOB let alone have one...

My PSK and hiking -kit is made for just one person. The BOB is for 4 persons (family of 4)

The only things others have used/loaned were water, flashlights and FAK-supplies.
I always carry more of those things on my person and in kit (and for redundancy of course), so it isn't really a problem, allthough I always say that they should purchase their own gear.

Camping and bugging are slightly different things. I've gone camping and carried the biggest pack because, well, as a big husky I am the size of BOTH the two young ladies I was camping with. (And nothing immoral occured.)

Bugging is different. There have only ever been two team bug out plans I've had. One is with family, and I'm carrying a lot of the heavy stuff but my mom comes up to my shoulder and my dad has a back problem. The other was in college, with a friend who has the same hobby (points into the mass of lurkers in the peanut gallery) who would have been humping his own gear; we had the same route to the halfway point before going in opposite directions on a major route.

If it is an actual get out of dodge, I'm alone or with people I trust. If I don't trust, I might give you water (bring your own bottle) and a lit stick (NOT a lighter, sparklite, match or anything else), but that is about it unless it is a barter item.

Better luck next time!

-Blast

Well, I figured someone would read something into the statement that wasn't there. :P Should have known it would be you.

Bah! Other than extra water, what's mine is mine. Will I share? Yes. But that means getting something back. My pack is just as heavy as the next guy, but if he's under packed, why should I make my pack heavier? He can borrow my knife, drink some of my water (he can keep that), use my fork while I use my spoon, squeeze into my tent. But to carry doubles of everything isn't really practical, much less fair, IMHO. I'm not in the business of giving things away, especially on a student's budget. Maybe to my girlfriend or brother, but that's about it.

I am in two minds on this. One side of me is the hard "its mine and you cant have it" side and the other is the one where I would help out anyone if they asked me.

Such as I always carry enough in my FAK to treat a good few minor injuries. I also carry two means of shelter.

What I wont do is carry enough food for anyone else. Whenever I go out my scoff is calculated for me for the length of time I'm out.

I suppose in a life saving scenario you would share, I would hope someone would do the same for me.

When I'm camping or just out having a good time, I will share any part of my gear. In a bug out situation I might help you and give you some info but I won't give up my gear without a fight.

Immoral and fun can be two totally different things...

Well, I suppose in theory that might be true...

-Blast

I consider carrying a little extra as an investment.

If something happens to my hiking partner because they are not as equipped as they "should" be, then it's going to fall to me to drag their butt out.

It's also a little cushion should Murphy chose to tag along (being the party pooper that he is).

There's a balance of course between me being the pack mule and the other person being responsible for his/herself.

I only hike with those I care about so the investment isn't a burden.

In the wilderness I often duplicate essentials and have whomever I am with carry them along. Some things such as bandaids, and aspirin and so forth are for sharing. My 10yr. old carries an emergency blanket, mirror, and now firesteel & tinder, a small Swiss army and a lanyard held photon light and whistle in addition to trail gear in a pack. The lanyard is "always, always on.
In a true survival situation I figure what you have is what you have be it myself or others and for me the smaller and lighter it is the more probable I'll have it so things like eating utensils are out.
I have to say, in the great outdoors, if you need it and I do not you've got it. If we both need it we will just have to share.....

My kits are all social.

My BOB sits at home and is tailored towards my immediate family needs, not just personal. I won't bug out without my family. Gathering family is part of my emergency plan.

My office and car kits are tailored towards getting me home, probably on foot ~7 miles, and contains the usual stuff people cite here. But they also include a supplement bag - a healthy supply of ABD pads, triangle bandages, cheap plastic ponchos, latex gloves, masks and other things I'm pretty sure I'll be using or handing out before I get home - there are 300 people in my office building alone, after a quake some of them will need to apply pressure, or worse. Many of them will exit the building coatless into PNW cold and rain. I'm not currently on a team tasked with helping them all, but I intend to help as many as resources allow. Until my employer stocks and prepares adequately, that's my commitment. Bought in bulk, these things are cheap, mostly non-perishable and worth having than not.

My home kits include similar provisions for neighborhood triage and assistance. I won't feed them all, but I have supplies and training to give basic first aid, set up a triage with others and some emergency shelter and warmth for at least immediate neighbors as necessary. Again, the community isn't organized for more than that yet, and government response could be days away. My 'community' kit reflects the commitment and training I can contribute if the shake happens tomorrow (think CERT).

The natural follow on to social kits is community preparedness - neighbors and office workers. I'm finding that slow going.

Ladies and Gents. IMHO there is a difference between equipping a dumb/lazy/ignorant... whatever person that continually under prepares for recreational endeavors,equipping to protect family members and others that either can't carry their own load (wife bad knees, daughter too young to carry much), and those that won't (wife), and preparing for rescues.

For recalcitrant others, I have a neighbor, older couple, pretty well off. On several occasions, I've helped them out by blowing their driveway after a heavy snow fall. I suggested they get a snow blower or contract with someone to plow their driveway. As of yet, they still shovel. Experience is a wonderful teacher, and if you face adversity often enough, most people will adjust. If not???

Rescue; How much can you carry, and in what scenarios would you rescue others? I'm an ex-EMT and an RN. I'm still trying to figure out how to carry a MASH unit in addition to all the other stuff (wife bad knees/non believer)that fill my bag. The conclusion I've come to is that I will never be able to carry enough to address everyones needs. I will equip and educate myself to reasonably answer my families needs and will help others when and as i can without compromising my families position. Regards, Jim