Opinions on Kenwood TH-F6A?

Hi all,

I just got my technicians license, and I'm looking for a hand-held tranceiver for working with the San Francisco NERT team. It's to be used for communicating between neighborhood staging areas and the emergency response district office. I also plan to have fun with it too ;-).

I'm concidering a tri-band Kenwood TH-F6A. The pricetag of $310 at http://www.hamcity.com is within my budget. I'm also planning on getting a 144/220/440 MHz. tri-band portable antenna to replace the rubber ducky. A spare battery pack would also be useful.

Any opinions and suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks!
Lynn

This review provides a fairly detailed look at the unit. Don't know if Kenwood's made any changes since the review was written. You'll see that he frequently compares performance factors to the Yaesu VX-5R. As you may know, Yaseu has since come out with the VX-6R.

If you navigate back to his main page, you'll find link to his review on another TH-F6A competitor – the Icom IC-T90A.

Edit to add another link: Review here of the TH-F6A in ARRL's QST Magazine.

lmonsanto,

The quality of the top brands is all pretty good. The biggest difference for me is the user interface.

I started out with all Yaesu gear. Yaesu is very cool and sexy. Unfortunately, I quickly tired of the user interfaces. I didn't find them to be very intuitive. My memory sucks and I didn’t want to have the owners manual tethered to my wrist just to operate it. Over time I replaced everything with Icom gear. Overall it was just simpler and more intuitive for me to use. I was much happier. My weird observation: The Yaesu gear seems to cater more to an "eastern" mind. The Icom gear seems to cater more to a "western" mind. (Whatever that means). I have very little experience with Kenwood gear. When I was looking at HF gear I read some reviews complaining about the user interface on the Kenwoods.(maybe a southern mind?) I never pursued further.

I found that I could run the Icom gear without much help from the manual. The Yaesu gear was always more confusing to me. My Yaesu HT had the volume or the squelch (there goes my memory again) as a menu item. D’oh! What were they thinking? My current Icom HT has volume and squelch on a knob. As it should be. I don’t want to have to execute a string of button presses to make a simple adjustment like volume or squelch.

In ham radio circles there seem to be plenty of “function” geeks. Their philosophy: A radio can never do too much. A radio can never be too complicated. “Just give me another bell, whistle, gee-gaw, or festoon and I don’t care how far its capabilities are buried in treacherous menus with button pushes requiring both hands and one foot”. Personally, I place a higher value on simplicity and reliability. (I’m so analog).

If you are a member of the ARRL you can go to their web site for some quality reviews.
http://www.arrl.org/

Also check out http://www.eham.net/

My advice: Find a well stocked ham radio store and play with the gear first. My guess is after a bit of playing around you'll have your answer. If you can operate it the first time without looking at the manual you’ve got a winner.

Regarding NERT. Make sure they actually have a use for you. Years ago our neighborhood began organizing and training for NERT. I was the Comm guy. I attended a local ARES/RACES meeting to find out how NERT would coordinate them. (It seems I was the first one to bother to do this) There was no procedures in place to communicate with NERT and no plans to change it. I called the county (Promoters of NERT). Same story. No procedures in place for the NERT to communicate with anyone outside the neighborhood. Within the neighborhood you are probably better off with FRS radios. Here, NERT is a great plan with no procedures to pass along critical communications. Our NERT pretty much fell apart after that.

Congratulations on your ticket!

Good luck, TR

I have the TH-F6A. It was the first radio I bought when I got my Tech ticket in 2001. It is a phenomenal radio, so much so that I haven't used all of the features yet. That may be it's only drawback, it has too much on it. It is easily programmable via computer with free software available on line. The gotcha is the cable interface is not free.

For accesories I have the speaker mike which I find extremely useful, a second battery pack and a AA battery pack. I built an inexpensive groundplane antenna and a roll up J-Pole, although I have found the stock rubber duck to work fine, and that has been the biggest complaint I've even seen anyone have about the radio.

In my opinion (and it's only my opinion) is to buy Kenwood HTs, Icom mobiles and Yaesu base radios.

Yahoo user group

Please feel free to ask me more specifics about it.

That was interesting to see that an AA battery pack is available for the TH-F6A. I've been put off by the proprietary lithium packs of the current Yaesus, and Icom doesn't seem to make a small radio in this class. I'm sort of interested in a small dual bander (2m/440) that can run on AA's. I hadn't really thought about 222mhz and am not sure I care about it. But the TH-F6A is nice and small, unlike earlier tribanders. Does anyone know if the TH-F6A lithium pack is actually repurposed from some other device? For example, the VX-5R pack is apparently the same pack used by some Fuji digicam, so you can get low cost compatible replacements. Also, does using the 4AA pack make the TH-F6A bigger by much?

The battery pack is the BT-13, and is the same size as the regular pack.

Kenwood TH-F6A weight with PB-42L Battery 8.8 oz.

Icom IC-T90 weight 8.5 oz.

http://www.icomamerica.com/products/amateur/t90/

Let me chime in and say that I love my F6. I carry it everywhere. The things that I love the most are:

1) Built-in bar antenna. The bar is tiny, but it helps a LOT when listening to AM broadcast. Yaesu does not have this.

2) Dual receive. You can listen to two repeaters at the same time, or one repeater and one broadcast. This is VERY handy, and Icom does not have this.

Of course, I look ath the Yaesu models which are waterproof, and think that this is a very cool feature if you are going to be out on a boat.

Another thing is that the programming software for the F6 is available free over the web. Then, all that you need is an interface that converts RS-232 levels to 5V TTL levels. I had most of the parts for such an interface lying around. So it cost me about $5 to get my HT hooked up to my computer. Yaesul will charge you at least $35 for this honor.

My only complaints:
1) the rubber "port covers" over the mic/charging jacks is starting to wear out. But I have had this HT for 2-1/2 years.
2) Stock antenna is not very impressive. But you can fix this for less than $50.
3) The "joystick" is close to useless for me. I never use it. When setting menu options, I use the tuning knob. The stick could have been replaced by one or two buttons, leaving more room for a bigger speaker.
4) You can have one frequency set for CTCSS transmit only, and another for CTCSS transmit/receive. So, you can set the CTCSS frequency, and switch CTCSS modes, and you frequency has changed, and nothing works. This is one of those "what were they thinking" issues, but once you know about it, it is easy to fix.
5) Shortwave receive is a little noisey. Even with a S9+ signal, you will still hear some noise in the background
6) SSB filters are VERY wide. Actually, it is more like a double-side-band receive. The sound is essentially the same whether you are in USB or LSB mode. Of course, getting SSB at all in a unit this size that does this much is amazing, so I do not fault the unit too much for this. However, using SSB on a contest day is, of course, out of the question, as you will get QSOs on the "other" side band, complete with spectral-inversion garbling goodness. For listening to the occasional QSO (with the right antenna of course), it should be OK as long as the "other" side band is clear and quiet.
7) I wish that the battery meter was displayed all the time, and that the resolution of the batter meter was a little better. Not a big deal, though. Most HTs do not do this.
8) It should have television audio frequencies pre-programmed in (and marine channels would be nice too). But since you have a LOT of memories to play with in this thing, an hour of sweat can overcome this problem.

So, all in all, not a perfect radio, but I love mine a lot. I am glad that I got mine, and I would buy another one if this one died.

I'm surprised to find the F6 has been around almost 4 years and the other comparable units are about as old. Mfgrs aren't introducing radios like this any more. I wonder what's up with that. And I have to say the reviews linked above aren't all that flattering. Is 222 mhz very active in most places? Buying a tribander hadn't really occurred to me before (I just wanted 2m/440). Does the F6 have a way to send DTMF tones? Does anyone care about that any more?

I had an F6 for a couple of years -- as others have mentioned, it's a nice radio. I'm not sure how much use you'll get out of the 220MHz band, but the F6 has a lot of other features.

Definitely invest in a "AA" battery pack; it provides very limited power, but it's good to have in an emergency.

$310 isn't a bad price at all; you might check over at Ham Radio Outlet in Oakland. Plus there's nothing like being able to go in an actual store to try the radio (and others) out.

I'll second that using the computer programming is a big plus. What a timesaver!

Whatever you wind up buying, good luck and enjoy!

DTMF is there. There are even DTMF memories. Check out the Kenwood web site and download the users manual. In fact, if you are also considering a Yaesu, download the manual for that one too. Read both of them to get an idea for how they work.

You are correct about the F6 being a little long in the tooth. However, you have to realize that amateur radio is a niche market. For every HT that is sold, probably 1000 mp3 players and digital cameras are sold, so you cannot expect the same frantic product cycle. but the Kenwood is still a good solid radio. Yes, there are a few comprmises in the general receiver. But one thing that I love is that it has two receivers. The "A" receiver is optimized for ham bands only, and it does a good job. The "B" receiver is the DC-to-daylight one, and it is hard to get great performance and a huge tuning range together. I am just amazed that you can get so much functionality in a package this size. The electronics (minus the battery pack) is about the size of a deck of cards -- amazing.

In my opinion, the Kenwood and the Yaesu VX-7R are both wonderful units. You can't go wrong with either one. The Yaesu is waterproof and has 6M, and almost no power on 220. The Kenwood has no 6M, 5W in 220, SSB receive, and a bar antenna.

BTW: One thing about the Yaesu that kind of annoyed me is that it has the flashing light on the front, and a "slot machine" video game built-in. This just struck me as being to goofy. I wanted an HT where the engineers were focusing on performance, not flash.

Harrkev, thanks, I really hate devices that depend on proprietary batteries. I don't want to buy one that can't use AA's. The Yaesu apparently can't use AA's at all. The Icom has the IC-215 pack available that holds two AA's, but output power is limited to 0.1 watts and the AA's (1.2v 2500mAH x 2 = 6 WH) have much less total energy than the 7.4 volt 1300 mAH lithum battery (9.6 WH). The Kenwood's lithum pack is a little bit bigger (1500 mAH or 11.1 WH from Kenwood, 1800 mAH third party if you can believe the spec) but its AA pack holds four cells (12 WH) which is basically as good as the lithium pack. It looks like there's an extra-thick third party lithium pack with 3600 mAH which is also of interest. (I don't mind using a lithium pack when convenient, I just want the option of using AA's at other times). I don't know if it's even still possible to buy the proprietary packs for my old IC-2AT or IC-P4AT any more, but the AA packs still work fine.

It looks like the Icom is cheaper though, $255 at HRO.

I do not have the AA pack for mine, but one problem with alkalines is that they choke on high-current loads. So your TX power will be limited. This is not a problem for receiving, though. That is why custom lithiums are used.

And as for the aftermarket battery packs, check the specs. The 1800, if I recall correctly, is thicker than the standard battery. So it will work, but you will have to remove the belt clip. I have not looked at the pack in a year or so, so maybe the newer ones are the same size. Just something else to be aware of.

"I really hate devices that depend on proprietary batteries."

Originally I picked up the Icom OEM 4AA pack for my HT, but the output is lower than I was used to. (lithiums would help here).

A while back I found a site selling 6AA packs for my radio. That means a substantial increase in TX output for my HT. They had a nice selection of aftermarket AA packs for other HTs as well. Unfortunately after a computer upgrade I lost the link.

When I get a chance, I'll try to track it down again.

Also, not all radios have the same output on small battery packs. My original Yeasu did much better on the small pack than my Icom for wattage output. On the other side of the coin, the Icom would last much longer in an emergency (both RX and TX) due to it's lower output and miserly RX current drain.

If the low wattage output will consistantly get into several local repeaters, the TX may not be your biggest concern. Most HTs spend the vast majority of their life in RX mode. Getting an HT that sips, not gulps, current could be a big issue.

Good luck, TR

Thanks, I'd appreciate that link if you find it, pizzaman. What radio do you have?

I may not have been clear, my interest in an AA pack is not as an emergency backup. It would be for primary use and I'd put NiMH rechargeable cells in it. The lithium ion pack can be nice under some circumstances but I'd rather not have to replace it ($$$) or use a special charger for it. I try to choose devices that use AA's so I can run practically everything on NiMH cells and a couple of chargers that I share between everything. So I'd use the AA pack as the main pack, and the lithium ion pack as the backup, and maybe have some lithium AA cells for emergencies but the main cells would be NiMH. For the IC-P4AT there's a 6AA pack that works pretty well, for example.

"Thanks, I'd appreciate that link if you find it, pizzaman. What radio do you have?"

Paul,

I found the link:
http://www.batteriesamerica.com/icom1.htm

I'll be ordering a couple of these.

I have the Icom IC-T22a. I really like this radio. The specs for RX current consumption are superb. Like so many of these little radios the speaker is too small. I picked up a nice speaker mic from Pryme to improve the sound. The T22a also has one of the better stock antennas. So many of the compact HTs have absurdly small antennas. If you are running low TX, you need a good antenna. The Icom has a good antenna.

That said, I still have a collection of larger more efficient antennas (a longer duck antenna, a long telescoping antenna, and a roll up J Pole antenna).

Good luck, TR

Not to throw a wrench in the works, but I've heard some horror stories about Batteries America and their 6AA pack for the Icom radios. I was thinking about getting a couple of them for my IC-W32A (another fine dual-band choice), but after hearing about some other customers' experiences with that company, I elected to pass.

Michael-

Could you please elaborate...are we talking less than satisfactory battery performance, or have HTs been fried?

Thanks,

Dan

Thanks, Pizzaman. The T22A is a 2m unit and as mentioned I think I want a dual bander. FWIW, I've bought stuff from that battery pack company (E. H. Yost) before with no problems, though not that particular product. I still have an IC-P4AT, and lost in the mists I have an IC-2AT somewhere. I don't think the proprietary packs for those radios are even available any more, but I bought the AA packs for them when I bought the radios. So, I'm pretty determined to stick with AA-powerable units.

Actually if I go berserk, I might skip the whole tiny HT thing and get an FT-817. That would solve a lot of these issues all at once.