How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter?

Posted by: philip

How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/01/10 10:28 PM

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2010/02/...an-it-looks.php
TreeHugger has an article about rolling your own emergency bag with a green twist.

Jaymi's current bag weighs in at 30 lbs, and she thinks that's too heavy for scrambling over the Haiti-like rubble of San Francisco after the big one. Plus when she picked the bag up, a strap ripped. Oops. Maybe that's rule number 1: get a decent bag for your BOB?

She wants light stuff that's environmentally friendly. She includes crayons, coloring book, and a deck of cards, so I'm guessing kids are part of the picture.

Anyone have any suggestions for her? Is being green in a disaster relevant at all?
Posted by: Blast

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/01/10 10:50 PM

I'm thinking the most eco-friendly thing one could do in a disaster would be to die near a tree that will gain nourishment from your body. smirk

-Blast, in a bad mood
Posted by: clarktx

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/01/10 11:38 PM

I respect being green. But in an emergency I think there are far more important things to worry about than whether your BOB is environmentally conscious. BOBs are temporary, until you get wherever you are going.

Now, I think its a great idea for a rawlesian-style retreat. You don't want to poison your bug out location. Being green is really important in a self-sufficient environment.

But you were asking about BOBs, and my answer is that function comes first, form comes second, and "green" comes in a bit after that...

just my .02
Posted by: MDinana

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 12:17 AM

Originally Posted By: Blast
I'm thinking the most eco-friendly thing one could do in a disaster would be to die near a tree that will gain nourishment from your body. smirk

-Blast, in a bad mood

LOL! Thanks Blast - I got a laugh out of this. Kind of reminds me of how I told my GF I wanted to die someday (on my way to a nursing home for work one morning) - leave me out in the forest, pointed west (so I can watch the sun set) and let me turn into bear poop.

I think a BOB being eco-friendly (I hate the term "green) is hogwash. For a variety of reasons, the biggest being, how much trash can one person CARRY around? Food wrappers, used TP (ew!) and matches are about the only disposable things I can think of. And of those, TP and matches are fairly biodegradable.

Not to mention, most "disasters" are called that b/c they affect lots of people at once. Which typically means a population center - not the most "green" environment to start with.
Posted by: hikermor

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 12:57 AM

For one thing, the generic bag she now has is a worthless piece of junk, as are most of the contents. These things are hawked all over California after major shakers and they serve mostly to profit the sellers. She needs real canteens for one thing, and supplies that are suited to her situation. Some kind of coherent plan for the event might not be a bad idea either. Most of us could build a better emergency kit in 15 minutes with our eyes closed, and one hand tied behind our backs.

If she can't handle a thirty pound pack, preferably one whose straps won't rip, she should get in shape. Being green is a good thing, but the suggestions and concerns in the posted link are the equivalent of rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
Posted by: LED

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 01:10 AM

I've never looked at things in terms of being eco-friendly. I was just taught to be frugal, waste not want not, and buy with long term durability in mind. Just buy quality gear at seriously discounted prices and don't throw anything away until you've beaten the snot out of it, which'll probably be a very long time.
Posted by: ducktapeguy

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 01:39 AM

Best way to be green - Don't buy junk that'll end up breaking and get thrown in the trash.

Sometimes quality stuff isn't that expensive, especially if you're willing to buy secondhand or older gear. One good thing about changing fashions is that you can always find someone who's willing to lose money just to have the latest gear. In the last few years, I don't think I've ever paid more than 50% of the retail price for any of the outdoor equipment I've bought, and a majority of the time I'm paying less than 20-30%. On a lucky day I can pay less than 2%. It is still cheaper than the brand new junk most places sell.

Either way, in an emergency, that kind of stuff is way down the priority list. If you can worry about being green and what the carbon footprint of your backpack has, then it's not a very serious emergency. Honestly, I think most of the "green" movement is just a superficial way of making yourself feel better without actually having to do anything difficult, but then I'm a cynic.




Posted by: gatormba

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 01:57 AM

Under normal conditions I try to be as eco-friendly as I can but if the conditions have degenerated to the point I'm grabbing my BOB "eco-friendly" is the last thing I'm concerned about.
Posted by: dougwalkabout

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 01:59 AM

Most of the piece was a thoughtful review of a commercial kit, and ways to improve it or build your own that's better (and maybe greener). The last paragraph was tacked on to keep the editors happy; it had no real substance. Oh well, so it goes.

The life you lead at home determines 99.5% of your environmental impact; an emergency situation is hopefully a brief aberration. IMO, many environmentally responsible measures (using energy wisely, being less reliant on the day-to-day food and energy grids, buying durable goods, and not consuming more than you really need) go hand in hand with the subjects we discuss on this forum.

BTW, I always read the Treehugger Weekly Archives. They bring up all sorts of ideas, companies and technologies that are both useful and interesting to me. Being a grown-up, I can filter through the occasionally childish pronouncements without losing my cool.
Posted by: scafool

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 01:59 AM

My stuff is pretty eco-friendly.

I don't have a lot of packaging on my stuff and stuff that is in packages is in reusable packages that can be used for other things too if needed.

Edit: it isn't because of environmental concerns. It is just that everything gets tested and the store packaging gets discarded in the process.

Somebody already mentioned real water containers instead of drink baggies.
I would suggest LED flashlights that get far more hours out of a battery because batteries are heavy.

I didn't see any spare clothing in her bag and there seems to be some excessive redundancy with a tarp, space blankets, plastic trash bags and ponchos.

I would likely throw some bic lighters in even if I did keep the kitchen matches (which should definitely be in a match safe)
My personal preference is for one good solid knife in the kit.
It does not need to be big. Mora is OK, pretty good, pretty light, inexpensive.

I see very little sanitation stuff. A bit of soap bar, a small bit of rag and some TP might be welcome.

She is right to think she needs a stronger bag, it does not need to be fancy but it does need to be solidly made. A bag that is ripping apart without a serious load in it is not much good.

I think she is right to be concerned about the weight. There are a lot of people that would be in trouble if they had to carry 30 pounds for more than a few miles.

Maybe she could consider a bug out bundle buggy too.
One of those ones for dragging groceries home from the store but with decent wheels on it.
They are usually light enough to be carried past small obstacles if you needed to and are much easier to drag through a lot of places than a heavy back sack.
You would still be able to strap your pack on if the route got rough, but in the mean time you would be saving your back.

Posted by: dougwalkabout

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 02:06 AM

Most of the piece was a thoughtful review of a commercial kit, and ways to improve it or build your own that's better (and maybe greener). The last paragraph was tacked on to keep the editors happy; it had no real substance. Oh well, so it goes.

The life you lead at home determines 99.5% of your environmental impact; an emergency situation is hopefully a brief aberration. IMO, many environmentally responsible measures (using energy wisely, being less reliant on the day-to-day food and energy grids, buying durable goods, and not consuming more than you really need) go hand in hand with the subjects we discuss on this forum.

BTW, I always read the Treehugger Weekly Archives. They bring up all sorts of ideas, companies and technologies that are both useful and interesting to me. Being a grown-up, I can filter through the occasionally childish pronouncements without losing my cool.
Posted by: philip

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 04:31 AM

> If she can't handle a thirty pound pack, preferably one whose straps won't
> rip, she should get in shape.

Keep in mind that _some_ of us can't get in shape. :->
Posted by: Alex

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 05:04 AM

My first thought on the topic was about feasibility of a biodegradable bug out bag smile

Seriously, IMHO, BOB content must be environmentally friendly by definition. You shouldn't have any reason to throw out even a smallest piece from it. If you do - that means your BOB is far from optimal (Okay, let's exclude the TP from the rule).
Posted by: Susan

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 06:26 AM

A BOB that is chosen to be environmentally friendly is just ahead of one that is politically correct, IMO.

Sue
Posted by: sybert777

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 12:47 PM

Environmentally friendly is what you see envivonmentally as. If you seee that burning a tree or paper is bad because it puts CO2 in the environment, you probably wont last so long. If you see that littering is bad, you are quite a bit smarted because in an emergency situation, NOTHING is trash, unless it is a cheap/ripped back pack! (and toilet paper, unless-- I know its nasty but if it is used and you have a bag available, use it as tinder or kindling. it would probably stink though!!

Anyone elses view on this^?
Posted by: hikermor

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 01:00 PM

Originally Posted By: philip
>

Keep in mind that _some_ of us can't get in shape. :->


You do make an excellent point, but the those who can't get in shape comprise a very small percentage of our rather sedentary population.

We don't talk about it much, but fitness is a definite factor in survival preparedness.

On the other hand, considering the inhumanely cheap pack she was using, thirty pounds would feel much better in almost anything else.
Posted by: MostlyHarmless

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 01:13 PM

Originally Posted By: sybert777
If you see that littering is bad, you are quite a bit smarted because in an emergency situation, NOTHING is trash, unless it is a cheap/ripped back pack! (and toilet paper, unless-- I know its nasty but if it is used and you have a bag available, use it as tinder or kindling.


Agreed, nothing is trash! Used toilet paper is fertilizer, not trash. Bury it somewhere moist and not too deep, that will speed up the process. Don't let it flap around, that is just plain disgusting. Or you could burn it: Collect it in the dirtiest, nastiest container/bag and toss it on the fire.


You COULD use it as kindling, but I would rather try to find nicer alternatives - those would be better for both the personal morale and the personal hygiene.
Posted by: JBMat

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 01:53 PM

We must remember, she is on the left coast, home to fruits and nuts. The country is tilted and all the loose nuts roll west.

That being said, I am about as eco friendly as the next guy... well, depending on who the next guy is. But in a situation where I have to grab my BOB and go, I am more worried about being "Preserve butt" friendly" than worried if I am stepping on a rare plant or squishing some next extinct toad.

Most of pre-prepared kits sold on the internet and in stores are cheapo crap. The most sensible thing to do is determine what you need, buy quality goods that will last, carry no more than you need/have to have and know how to use what you have.
Posted by: Nicodemus

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 03:21 PM

I try to be a very responsible consumer and take environmentalism into concern in my daily life. That has carried over into my BOB, but more in the way of ideas that most here have expressed already. I purchased good solid equipment that I'll hold on to, rechargeable NiMH Batteries and freeplay devices, and by the thought that most things can have multiple purposes.

Sure, there are a few things that will be left behind for hundreds or thousands of years after I and most of my equipment has decomposed; such as plastic buckles, knife scales and such; but overall it's minimal.
Posted by: TeacherRO

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 03:53 PM

1. No d cells
2. more water
3. better backpack. If you want to go green, buy it used from Goodwill
4. No cell phone charger?

Posted by: chaosmagnet

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 06:52 PM

My BOB has at least one non-eco-friendly component that I think is important: lithium batteries. I don't want to rely upon rechargeables, both because they self-discharge far more quickly than quality lithium batteries, and because they're more sensitive to the temperature extremes that occur in the trunk of my car.

Eco-friendliness is not high up on my list of priorities for buying and maintaining emergency equipment.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 08:52 PM

I think this is something the writer bought to feel like she's prepared, rather than actually investing time to learn how to use skills and equipment to save her @%% in an actual emergency.
Even 10-20 hours invested in reading proper material would educate her enough to know that's not everything she may need, and a lot of the provided equipment appears substandard to say the least. It's better than nothing, maybe. She should start off by purchasing at least a decent urban survival book. Lofty Wisemans' books are a good starting place. After digesting that, maybe she should go visit a real camping store, she mentions REI. Start with a pack and basics. When done, craig's list the kit she bought before she knew better. Most importantly, buy two or more of the most critical disposable items and practice. As she's in california, one last thing to mention. Tie a gas shutoff wrench to the pack with paracord and tape in place with electrical tape. There's a couple of combination tools out there that claim to do both gas and water valves. turn them both off on the way out..or as soon as you return.

Last tip: Acquire a 3-4' section of garden hose with a female end. also acquire a 4 way silcock wrench. Hot water heaters are normally full of water, and they have a shut off valve at the top...and a drain at the bottom, sometimes without a handle. why pack a lot of water when you can probably scavenge clean water after a quake. You can release the vacuum by opening up the T&P valve at the top.
Posted by: philip

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 10:14 PM

> You do make an excellent point, but the those who can't get in shape comprise
> a very small percentage of our rather sedentary population.

Well, I'm not so sure. My baby boomer buds are getting older and more decrepit as the days go by, and we're an enlarging part of the population. shrug - but I'm just reminding all the young whippersnappers that some of us are geezers beyond hope. :->
Posted by: MDinana

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 10:52 PM

Originally Posted By: philip
> If she can't handle a thirty pound pack, preferably one whose straps won't
> rip, she should get in shape.

Keep in mind that _some_ of us can't get in shape. :->

Philip, "round" IS a shape laugh
Posted by: ironraven

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/02/10 11:29 PM

As my reply to her article said (if it actually posts- their server is taking its time), I don't think this is green OR honestly prepared.

Those flashlights retail for about $5, and don't throw as well as a $15 headlamp that runs on 2AAs. And they'll break easily. Yeah, real green- expensive, and full of junk that will end up in the landfill. Bravo.

The evil part of my brain wants to take her kids, and show them the torn backpack, and tell them that this is supposed to keep them safe because mommy loves them oh so much.
Posted by: sodak

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 12:13 AM

I'm the wrong person to ask. I'm an old fashioned conservationalist who thinks "eco-friendly" and "green" are marketing bs, nothing more. Even more so in an urgent situation.
Posted by: haertig

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 12:46 AM

When I looked at the contents of the kit pictured in that link the first thought that came to my mind was, "Did they do their shopping at Toys-R-Us?"

And what is eco-friendly (or even useful) about a cheap plastic flashlight that probably won't last 5 minutes before it's ready for the trash? I guess that's why they put two of them in there.

While the coloring book and crayons (sure to melt) are a nice feel-good touch, I propose that you'd be better off with a big purple Barney doll. At least you could use the crowbar (?) to beat Barney senseless and use the stuffing for tinder, and the left over carcass as a belt bag. The kids would probably have more fun using the crowbar on Barney than coloring anyway.
Posted by: Dagny

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 01:38 AM


I've not given any thought to how eco-friendly my BOB is and that would be far down my list of priorities in assembling a BOB.

If I'm living out of a backpack at some point then my carbon footprint and other environmental impact will have been greatly reduced no matter what's in it or what it's made of.

DC imposed a grocery bag tax this year so now that I'm lugging my own bags to the store I'm feeling environmentally virtuous enough for the moment.







Posted by: soli

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 01:28 PM

Hi all, long time lurker, figure I'll use this thread to cut my teeth smile Not necessarily a treehugger but I think, like the large majority, I'll do my best be be conscientious to everyone and every thing.

Originally Posted By: greytruck444
I think this is something the writer bought to feel like she's prepared

Originally Posted By: haertig
And what is eco-friendly (or even useful) about a cheap plastic flashlight that probably won't last 5 minutes before it's ready for the trash?


This isn't the case. In the first paragraph she clearly states her family bought it for her due to their concerns, it was not a pack she made to be eco friendly. It's not until the recent events in Haiti did she even bother considering a BOB. The article is asking for how to improve a pre packaged BOB in the greenest possible way. I see it as a good thing that she is actually re-evaluating the contents of the off the shelf BOB.

Originally Posted By: philip
so I'm guessing kids are part of the picture.


I may be incorrect in this assumption but they may just be part of the pack. She does not state how many people will use the bag. The bag appears to have been an off the shelf purchase, configured for a group of 4 (incl child)

Originally Posted By: clarktx
I respect being green. But in an emergency I think there are far more important things to worry about than whether your BOB is environmentally conscious.


Not singling you out, but this sentiment appears to be a repeating theme in a number of the replies to this thread. I think people might be confusing configuring a BOB, in advance of an emergency situation, with "green" products and living a green lifestyle while bugging out. I see no reason why building a bob and choosing environmentally friendly solutions must be mutually exclusive.
I see it more in choosing the materials than living the lifestyle.

For example:
- Replace the plastic flashlight with a good quality metal flashlight.
- The survival blankets will probably be pretty cheap and at best get one use. Replace with something like a heatsheet which is much stronger and reusable.
- Poncho's as with the blankets are more than likely going to be pretty flimsy. Replace with something more reliable.
- A bag that isn't going to fall apart on first carry.

Of course, there is one down side to upgrading the BOB. It's not overly green, you still have to do something with the items that were swapped out smile



Now the one thing that most have over looked, that I'm surprised more have not made suggestion for, is her problem with the weight. Plenty of options for reducing weight and in a relatively green (good quality long lasting products) way.





Posted by: Compugeek

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 02:12 PM

Quote:
Of course, there is one down side to upgrading the BOB. It's not overly green, you still have to do something with the items that were swapped out smile

Set them up around the home for use in a non-bugout situation. Or donate them.
Posted by: soli

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 02:22 PM

Originally Posted By: Compugeek

Set them up around the home for use in a non-bugout situation. Or donate them.


oops forgot to add that, yes good options. Although if you won't use an item due to it not being up to the challenge would you feel right passing it off to someone else...
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 06:48 PM

soli: I don't know about you, but before I go spending more than $20.00 on anything I might need to trust my life with, or to give to somone I care about, who might need it to trust their life with, I spend 5 minutes on google. I do think that package of overpriced sub-par quality stuff was at least an unresearched purchase, by whom or for whom notwithstanding. Based upon rereading the article, your point IS well taken. It still looks like something FEMA would stockpile, minimum standard quality, assembled by the lowest bidder.

As far as reducing the weight, good point. The amount of gear someone needs to survive is inversely proportional to their previous practice, experience, skill, and education. I believe in a previous post I mentioned buying a good urban survival book..

I wasn't going to critique the contents, but maybe I should.

1) flashlight, functional maybe for bedside coloring book?? let me drop it on concrete once. get a metal one with LED lamp.
2) Prybar ? It's on the tarp in the pic..Looks like the cheap chinese knockoff of the vaughan superbar. I've bent a couple of those generics beyond recognition in the past. Get the real thing.
3) Tarp. The brown/silver ones with reinforced corners will keep the heat off. Blue ones will not. Those cheap blue ones start falling apart after 3 days in the sun. Been there, Done that. Hurricane Charley '04. The 5x7 isn't big enough, need the 10x12.
4) carrying all that lifeboat water. ok, if you're in a lifeboat without a Mk6 desalinator. Me personally, some canteens, water tabs, silcock wrench and 4 feet of garden hose is lighter, and more useful. Awful hard to discipline the troops or smack the neighbor's terrified rottweiler off your child with a 4 ounce water pouch. pack a larger bladder if you can haul it.
5) food. she mentioned REI.. while there buy a decent pack, cooking gear and a stove, if possible, a tent. Likely food will be available for the digging.
6) medkit: didn't get a listing, probably doesn't have betadine, iodine tincture,triple antibiotic ointment, much less hemostatics. Also likely doesn't have a 1 week supply of basic OTC drugs, nor enough sterile gauze pads or tape. May not have tweezers even. replace/purchase to stock it appropriately.
7) waterproof matches. no backup of a bic lighter, ferro rod, etc.
8) are the masks N95 rated ?
9) Gloves. I shudder to think of most people's hands after using those for a day. get a good pair.
10) rope. get a hundred feet of paracord.

IMHO, rest of the stuff appears to be of some use.

Now on to my opinon of what is missing:
1) tools to turn off gas and water. available in lightweight aluminum.
2) 6 in 1 screwdriver, small hammer. a few nails.
3) local, city, and state maps and compass.
4) Duct tape, the universal fastener.
5) bug juice
6) hand sanitizer
7) toilet paper
8) hand crank radio
9) changes of clothes for everyone
10) footwear, like boots..
11) hat for each and multiple bandannas
12) raingear
13) a good multi-tool.
14) any legal documents you might need.
15) electrolyte packets, like gatorade
16) sunscreen.

If she has kids...
diapers ?
wipes ?
lotion ?
pacifiers ?
formula ?

if she has a car, or generator and intends to use either..super siphon or equivalent. Expect to scavenge fuel, legalities aside.

If not, a simple 'radio flyer' childs' wagon has use, to haul kids and/or the pack, at least, on debris free areas.

Those that think they're going to get out easily and travel light, might find the roads impassible, bridges down.
After a major quake it might be better to sleep outside for a few days, so planning for that isn't overplanning for immediate evac if the roads are closed. Sheltering in place or close to it is likely to happen for the survivors, whether by intent or circumstance. Maybe for a week or more.

Posted by: soli

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 08:48 PM

Originally Posted By: greytruck444
soli: I don't know about you, but before I go spending more than $20.00 on anything I might need to trust my life with, or to give to somone I care about, who might need it to trust their life with, I spend 5 minutes on google.


I wholly agree and would have done the same.

Having said that (I'm making assumptions here), not everyone is going to be as mistrusting of off the shelf kit, unfortunately. I also know if I was in the authors shoes, my parents would have bought this with the best of intentions but unfortunately knowing no better and would not have had the inclination to google for info.


Originally Posted By: greytruck444

I wasn't going to critique the contents, but maybe I should.


I don't think that's needed here smile We all pretty much see how bad that is.

It's unfortunate that the author did not post here, as she would have got good reliable feedback. As it stands there are essentially 2 trains of though going on in separate locations. One here, poo-pooing the eco side of things and missing (for the most part) her plea for advice and the other on treehugger ignoring her requirement for reliable kit and suggesting hokey or less than reliable 'eco' solutions.

If the comments on the site were working I'd stick a link to this thread so she could get some real advice.
Posted by: hikermor

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 08:49 PM

Originally Posted By: philip
> Well, I'm not so sure. My baby boomer buds are getting older and more decrepit as the days go by, and we're an enlarging part of the population. shrug - but I'm just reminding all the young whippersnappers that some of us are geezers beyond hope. :->


First Sergeant Hikermor reporting for duty: Age is not an excuse, although it does correlate with genuinely debilitating conditions. You don't have to be marathon fit to improve your survival status immensely, but you don't want to be sedentary. Note I was talking about those who Can't get in shale, as opposed to those who Don't get in shape.

If you are a boomer, you are younger than I am.. Give me twenty.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/03/10 10:06 PM

I sent the editor an email. A life is a life, even if it's a left winger site, maybe someone there can see the light.

Posted by: Eugene

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/04/10 01:19 AM

I stumbled across treehugger a couple years ago when looking for info on solar/wind power and such.
There is some overlap between "treehugging" and preparedness. The soaps and such without bad chemicals and perfumes and dyes are perfect for camp soap since they are the same thing as the camp stuff, i.e. safe to use in the environment.
There are some good ideas about solar/wind power which I want to use on my cabin on the farm, the people on that site just want you to go grid tied to share the power you generate.
I don't hang out there much, the people there are always wanting people to tolerate their lifestyles and political and religious beliefs but are always starting threads putting down others lifestyles and political and religious beliefs and thus become the most intolerant people I've known so you have to go there being well prepared.
Posted by: TeacherRO

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/04/10 04:18 PM

Her pack & prep all depend on one thing -- Where is she going when she bugs out?
A mile to her folks? To the bus station? 20 miles by foot out of town with kids? To stay at the neighborhood red cross shelter?
Posted by: ducktapeguy

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/04/10 06:39 PM

Originally Posted By: soli

It's unfortunate that the author did not post here, as she would have got good reliable feedback. As it stands there are essentially 2 trains of though going on in separate locations. One here, poo-pooing the eco side of things and missing (for the most part) her plea for advice and the other on treehugger ignoring her requirement for reliable kit and suggesting hokey or less than reliable 'eco' solutions.


After going back and re-reading the article a little more carefully, I do see how the it could be taken in different ways. One could read it and come off thinking that being eco-friendly at all costs, rather than practical, is her primary goal. But, maybe there is something more to it. It might be that she is just trying to encourage preparedness without scaring people away by giving it a more "marketable" view. I'm guessing that writing an apocalyptic, "grab your guns and head for the hills" type article for treehugger magazine probably wouldn't go over to well with the editors and their readers, so she is just using this as a way to inform people of the deficiency of a store bought kit and get them thinking about preparing for an emergency. She mentions how hard it is to find an emergency kit with all green items, and it's up to the reader to decide what's important. So she's not completely oblivious to some of the compromised you have to make. Also, she's definitely taken steps in the right direction by adding reusable bottles, water filtration, and solar power devices to her kit, so it appears that she's more intelligent than we give her credit for. Either way, being "green" and semi-prepared is better than not being prepared at all.

Posted by: Brangdon

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/06/10 12:14 PM

Originally Posted By: Eugene
There is some overlap between "treehugging" and preparedness.
Agreed. What I took from the article was an emphasis on sustainability. Replace single-use plastic bags of water with reusable bottles. Replace battery-powered devices with solar-powered ones. Reuse is better than recycling. It's "green", and it's also good in an emergency which may last longer than you expect.

It was also interesting to note the entertainment and feminine hygiene products (um, that's two separate categories), which some readers might overlook.

I disagree with a lot of her specific choices. Anything electric will use batteries, which will have a shelf-life: even if it's solar-powered it will need a battery to store that power. And wind-up devices have a lot of moving parts. Batteries can be the best solution, but it's good (and green) to pick low-power products that will get the most use out of them. A colouring book is less long-lived than a deck of cards, and the cards can entertain adults as well as children. But we all have our personal beliefs.
Posted by: Eugene

Re: How eco friendly is your BOB? Does it matter? - 02/09/10 11:19 AM

Originally Posted By: Brangdon
Originally Posted By: Eugene
There is some overlap between "treehugging" and preparedness.
Agreed. What I took from the article was an emphasis on sustainability. Replace single-use plastic bags of water with reusable bottles. Replace battery-powered devices with solar-powered ones. Reuse is better than recycling. It's "green", and it's also good in an emergency which may last longer than you expect.

It was also interesting to note the entertainment and feminine hygiene products (um, that's two separate categories), which some readers might overlook.

I disagree with a lot of her specific choices. Anything electric will use batteries, which will have a shelf-life: even if it's solar-powered it will need a battery to store that power. And wind-up devices have a lot of moving parts. Batteries can be the best solution, but it's good (and green) to pick low-power products that will get the most use out of them. A colouring book is less long-lived than a deck of cards, and the cards can entertain adults as well as children. But we all have our personal beliefs.


Of course solar powered and wind up devices have an internal battery which tends to go bad from lack of use dut to sitting too long where my AA powered gear uses my good quality rechargeable AA's.