Re-Thinking Batteries

For a long time, I was on a mission to eradicate all but AA batteries from my life. It was a quixotic mission, at best, as it seemed that every time a "must-have" bit of electronic kit came out, it would have some exotic battery (Coast Flashlights & "N" cells, various handy gizmos with "AAAA" cells).

In the last year, the amount of kit I have with various button cells - those flat disk batteries - seems to have proliferated. Add to that my kids getting various toys of all sorts, and I had to concede defeat and start stocking a level of button batteries in the same way I stocked AA cells (and, I have to admin, "D" cells, which are exceedingly wonderful for their power to weight ratios).

But what to stock? There's approximately 3,456,344,023 slight variations on the button cell theme, but after a review of what we have and use the most, the list quickly trims down to the following:

CR2032 - This flat battery is found in everything from your desktop computer (it backs up the BIOS settings) to wrist watches. It's used in remote controls for electronics and in some garage door opener transmitters.
Pricing for CR2032's are insane. If you buy at a local store, they can be as much as $7.00 each, or you can buy online at a place like atbatt.com for about $1.34 each, and if you buy bulk packs (be careful, a lot of scammy operators out there) you can get them for as little as $0.35 each. I keep about 20 of them on hand.

CR2016. It looks like a 2032, it isn't. Used in much lower-drain applications, like clocks and remotes, the 2016 is the same diameter and half the thickness of a 2032. I also keep about 20 on hand.

LR44 (also called A76) is a relatively common small button cell. I've found this one in toys and devices of all kinds. I keep 10 on hand.

LR41 This is one of the most confusing of cells but I find it in a LOT of small devices and lights, and it's the battery used in the new eGear PICO light.
The LR 41 spec is for a 7.9mm Diameter, 3.6mm high, 1.5v alkaline cell with a 25 MaH capacity. But there are other 7.9 mm cells that are ALMOST the same height - the SR 726 at 2.6mm height and the SR721 at 2.1mm in height and the SR731 at 3.1mm height. They all will fit an LR41 opening - in the diameter, but the the device may not quite close right, and the voltage is 1.55 volts, which is not really a big deal, but it's not spec for the LR41. (Get my battery spex from this chart PDF file http://www.maxellcanada.com/pdfs/batteries/watch_micro.pdf) I keep 20 to 30 of these things around because they tend to be used in clusters of 3 in the devices I use.

Buy online, it's a lot cheaper. These batteries keep a long time, so you don't need to worry too much about them. There's a lot of stuff (like GPS devices) that use button cells for memory and settings backup and you tend to not notice them until they fail - after years and years of use.

I have kept to my guns about what to stock for batteries for well over a decade now. I pick up economy packs of AAA, AA, C and D as well as 9v transistor batts. I try to avoid owning anything that takes something other than those standards. The ones I stock are fairly universal, and can be had in everything from cheap industrial style to Lithium Ion. If I had to use a device that wouldn't accomodate one of these size batteries, I would grab an external battery holder and kluge it onto the device so I could use one of the standards.

I wouldn't have anything to do with 9v except that the CO and smoke detectors have to have them, and kluging those devices could get me in a lot of trouble if something went wrong (tampering with such safety devices is a no-no). As yet, there hasn't been anything I couldn't do without or find a substitute for that wouldn't take one of the standards, excpet that G2 Nitrolon flashlight I bought on an impulse in Baghdad.

I've been careful to not buy any gear that doesn't take AA's, kids toys don't fall under my gear list so they may have others but even then they tend to be AA, or AAA, or C or D. The only things I have that take coin cells are vehicle remote keyless which the physical key is the backup so I just toss a pack of those coin cells in the glove box.

All out computers are laptops and those have a small internal nicad back for the settings so its not a replace every couple years like a desktop. I've found nothing else I need that takes coin cells.

I have lithium AA and AAA's as my normal use and spare batteries about 20 of each size and 8 D lithium's plus 4 9 volt batteriew in my spares. I don't use C's or 123's so have none

I also am trying to lessen the logistical nightmare of battery types. I am finding it hard to do with infant/toddler toys but luckily they will grow and add a new challenge when the toys change. As far as the rest of my gear, the easiest thing for me is to think about multitasking different lights, etc.... to eliminate the challenge of stocking different batteries.

I have had good luck and great service from batterybob.com for all types of batteries. I'm just a happy customer, not involved with them at all.

Love the site, longtime lurker and first time poster.

Sean

Welcome to the site sperry!

I do it a little differently. I tend to look for items that use the "C" size. I do this because it's the least commonly used standard size battery. I have at least one radio and a couple flashlights that use C's.

If something happens and the standards run short, I suspect the AA and D sizes will go fast with plenty of C's left over.

Hi Sperry;

I am not sure of which brands at the moment, but I found some of the 9 and 6 volt batteries were just smaller batteries bundled in the case.
I opened one dead 9 volt out of curiosity once and found it was full of LR44 size button cells. Not all of them are like that though.
I am sure there is a list somewhere detailing what is in which cases. It might be handy to know.

I use rechargeable batteries for all the standard sizes.
Newer rechargeables like nickel metal hydrides perform quite well

I have standardized on AA and AAA Eneloops (or a store branded generic eneloop) for all our battery needs. These are used for the flashlights, mp3 player/radio, one small portable radio in the BOB, and one camera.

Beyond the above, I am not much of a electronic gadget person and do not foresee purchasing any new battery required gear in the near or longtime future.

I try to stick with AA (lithium & alkaline) and CR123 as much as possible. I do keep a few 9V around for the same reasons that benjamin mentioned. I also keep a few spare CR2025 batteries around for car remotes & a few D cells around for the Mag lights that I can't seem to get rid off.

The key to maintaining my battery stash is keeping some in a readily accessible location and the rest in the safe where the wife and kids can't raid the "reserve".

For anything I use regularly, I ruthlessly insist on AAs. Since the latest NiMH rechargables are excellent and cost-effective, I rarely use single-use alkalines. I do keep a couple of cases of generic alkalines to fill in any gaps.

The exceptions are internal rechargeables like cell phones and the cheap AAA headlamps I tuck in every car and kit.

P.S. The generic alkaline 9V's I have opened contained six sub-AAAAs in series. Potentially very useful.

I'm big on rechargeables - that way I don't have to buy the 25 packs....as often

Almost everything we have that takes those little button cells, I consider disposable.

I'm almost completely on AAs too except for some flashlights and a few 9v users. I still use AAA for some things, like keychain lights, headlamps, alarm clocks, etc. They're still much better than button cells but I try to stick to AA whenever I can.

In hurricane panic buys, I'd say D and AA disappear first. It seems like every family buys a D cell Maglite and batteries for a month. AAA and 9v aren't as popular, but nobody buys C cells.

I've definitely had the experience of seeing just C cells on the shelf. I was a big user of C cells in a Pelican SabreLite, but now I mostly use LED lights powered by rechargable AA cells. From an old Backpacker magazine article, I remember them saying that C cells are the most power for weight (in an alkaline).

I have a bunch of the old D cell lights, but, I find that with the evolution of smaller LED based lights, like some of the offerings from Fenix, I just don't reach for the big Maglights anymore. There's still a big 3 or 4 D-Cell in each of our vehicles (I did replace the bulb with Mag's drop in LED) but, it's probably more useful for breaking a window or in self defense...

I just seem to use the smaller lights, both for flood and throw needs. I either use a headlamp, on AAA's, or a small tactical style like a Fenix T10, which is on 123's, or a keychain light, on AAA's like a Fenix L0D. Of course, I've got a couple AA MiniMag's too, with the LED heads. I know I can get pretty good lights that are similar to the T10 that will run on AA's, or AAA's, but, the light intensity, size, throw, and, well, comfort/form of the T10 make it my favorite at the moment, so I'm stuck with 123's. I have a couple lights that use them anyway, an older 1 cell Nuwai, and a 3 cell from Cabella's that has an interesting square patterned lamp. I supposed if there's a shortage of one type of battery, I'll have something I can use!

I have some nice plastic holders for spare batt's that I picked up at County Comm. http://www.countycomm.com/CBH.htm They make them for AA and 123 size, hold 4 each. Good for throwing into a pocket of your BOB.

It is virtually impossible to pare down battery types. BTW, BatteryJunction is a great source for batteries (Energizer CR2016/2032's for $.95) No exotics and I've still got:

AA (alkaline, lithium, NiMH)
AAA (alkaline, lithium)
D
CR123
CR2016
CR2032


In a perfect world everything would run on my Eneloops.

No its not, I have almost everything AA with a couple AAA things left and the non important stuff on a couple others but those are not mportant enough to stockpile extras for.

Thanks for the link! Those seem a little pricey but I may have to pick up a few.

First of all, I'd like to clarify that I've been a proponent of AA cells - for EVERYTHING - for a long time, and have worked very hard to get the stuff I consider important for emergency preparedness to run on AA - and only AA cells. All lighting is LED/AA based, for example, as are the emergency radio receivers. However, my point in the stock of extra batteries was based in part on experiences we had down along the delaware river during the floods of 2004, 2005 and 2006. Although a relatively short-term situation, there were logistical challenges with resupply due to the river bridges being closed, and much to my surprise, we ran into a few situations where various devices - like garage door openers - went dead and there was nowhere to get replacement batteries.

I happen to think that one of the most important things to have is ready access to information, for example, I routinely grab a whole copy of Wikipedia.org and I have about 200 Megabytes of eBooks of all kinds, from the PDF versions of the service manuals for my vehicles and power equipment to top and other types of maps to various medical reference books. Thus, for me, keeping my computers healthy, happy and their BIOS functioning is part of my plan. I always have a spare laptop of some sort set up and ready to act as a reference library/ communications center. So I tend to think of the needs of communications gear too.

I understand your point but if batteries are cheap, why not stockpile some extras? I wish it could all be AA. However, Photons are great sources of emergency light that you can stash almost anywhere and with their lithium batteries (10yr. shelf life, cold tolerant) they work when you need them. Sure I could stash a bunch of Fauxtons but they're not water resistant and only have one mode. And then there's my watch (CR2025) and the smoke detectors (9V), and before you know it you've got an assortment of spares. There's also size and output to consider. While I don't like CR123's, I love my Surefire E1L outdoorsman and consider it a great emergency light. Single AA lithiums/rechargeables just don't have the juice (yet) of a 3V CR123.

I've bought a few photons and other similar coin cell lights and no of them lasted very long, they all eventually die in some way so I stick with AA powered lights.
Haven't worn a watch in years since they catch on everything, be it the inside of the server or brush. Surefire's are nice lights but there are other lights which are just as bright and run from AA's.
The logistics of stocking up make keeping various sizes more difficult, I've been there. You could buy 100 AA's and 100 AAA's and 100 C's and 100 D's and 100 of the others like 9v, cr123, etc or just buy 500 AA's and be done with it.
Rotating stock to keep all those sizes fresh take a lot more work too.
Plus at this point i have at least three sets of AA Eneloops for every piece of gear and items like my GPS will go 16 hours on a set of batteries so I have 3x16 hours of constant use for it before I even need to get into the backup alkalines and thats only if I can't get some of the other sets recharged.
The amount of $ I save bu not having those other sizes had allowed me to buy a lot more rechargeables and a nice charger/analyzer to make sure they run well. I'm at the point where I get longer runtime from an rechargeable than I do a name brand alkaline.

Holy ----, you can store the WHOLE of Wikipedia? Okay, this is OT, but how the heck do you do that? I like the idea of offline resources. As long as the sun keeps shining, I can power and maintain a couple of laptops for years.

New topic perhaps?

Wikipedia has a dvd download menu someplace, I saw it someplace.

Thats basically what I said, important things all are ran from AA's. I consider garage door openers to be less important since I can easily open them by hand. anything like that I buy one spare and keep it someplace and if the battery in the remote goes dead then I swap the fresh one in and buy another spare sometime when I get a chance. I've had garage door opener batteries last for years so they don't really need a large stock. Your computers will still work without the battery, you just might have to reset a couple settings each time.

I like my thumbdrive cases for batteries from Case Logic. Three pockets per side, each one holds two CR123s, 3 AAs, 4 AAAs, or a bunch of properly packed button and coin cells. And there is enough room to put in a cut down paint ball tube to hold two more 123s at the top with cotton between them, or a TONNE of button cells if they'll fit.

The middle one.


They are like 5-6 bucks at Wally World, more elsewhere.

I used the plastic cartridge holders for 7mm Mauser to hold AA batteries. Maybe a smaller caliber holder would work for AAAs. It worked OK. YMMV.

Hi everyone.
Been around reading all the great info on the site and forums for a while now. Signed up a few days ago and thought I’d make a post.
I did not see it mentioned in the thread, but thought I’d give some experience on AA rechargeable batteries.
I have used AA NiMH for many years. The problem with them is that they lose their charge just sitting there doing nothing. Place a set in a digital camera and 3 weeks later when you go to use the camera, they are dead. Good thing for those 15 minute chargers….
A few months ago I read about a hybrid NiMH battery called Eneloop. They claim that the battery will still retain 85% of its charge after 1 year in storage. When you buy them they already contain a charge.
I decided to buy a 4 pack of them to see how they compared to the current rechargeable I use. Wow what a difference. I can go well over 2 months in the camera with light use with these batteries and still have plenty of charge. I do not change them in the GPS anywhere as quick as with the old rechargeable batteries. They work great in the Fenix L1D, etc, etc.
I now have around 16-20 of these batteries and love them. Whenever something with regular AA batteries in it dies, I throw in some Eneloops.
All the old NiMH batteries were given away.
I highly recommend the Eneloops.

Ok, first off eneloops are not hybrid, there is nothing hybird about them, thats just a marketing name made up by rayovac for their eneloop equivalent. You have to be careful with the names, for example my MIL went in to a PC store to buy a memory stick and came out with that sony crap instead of the USB flash drive she wanted.
Second get rid of those 15 minute chargers and don't recommend them, they charge 4x as fast as what any NiMH battery is supposed to be charged and the end result is your batteries that should last 500-1000 cycles end up lasting only 50. And thats if they last that long, many people report their batteries charged that fast like to die in the charger or at random during use. It would be a bad thing to be in the woods using your GPS and have its batteries die due to the bad chargers.

True the Eneloop say nothing about being hybrids, I did take that from the Rayovac batteries.
The 15 minute charger was given away when I got rid of all the old NiMH batteries. I bought a nice La Crosse Technology BC-700 charger when I updated the batteries to all Eneloop.

I try to point that out, because people may look for 'hybrid' batteries and think rayovac is the only game in town and long term I haven't had good results from rayovac. I kept all my old NiMH for kid toys and the rayovac are not holding up nearly as well as sanyo batteries, add to that the whole rip of that was their renewal (which did work decent enough for me since i followed their directions, it was when my last charger died and I found out they stopped selling chargers that I had to throw out a lot of the batteries), to their alkaline batteries leaking in things that I've been steering people away from them now. Oh and their PS4 NiMH charger which turned out to only charge to 75% so I thought all my batteries were going bad after a couple years. Wasted $30 on that charger, I should have known that if it was sold it walmart it was crap. So I've been burned about 4 times by that company now if you only count types and not instances.

Are you sure you bought NiCad's. Those are kind of rare anymore. Are you sure they are not NiMH.

Those thumbdrive cases are indeed handy for all sorts of things.

For batteries I'm using and liking this case:

Tamrac MXS536801 Memory & Battery Management Wallet 4 (Black)

I'm fairly new to NiMH batteries but from what I understand they do require some routine maintenance (run a "break-in" every 20-30 use cycles) and benefit from a good charger with proper termination, charging rates, etc. Here's a great thread about the Maha C9000 charger with information that applies to all NiMH batteries. I'm re-reading that thread now to try and get the best performance out of my Eneloops. Good luck.


http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=145727

Although I haven't heard of them causing any device failures, high capacity energizer batteries are know to be very bad batteries and tend to die quite often, I assume it doesn't work with any decent batteries in it? I'm thinking the what if they leaked into it or whent overvolatge when they died or something.

They don't really require it but its helpful to get the best life out of them. Its also helpful to track and see what the capacity is.
I bought my first eneloops in january of 2006 and have ran an analyze cycle on them each year to check their capacity.

NiMH and Alkaline batteries should be just fine for your GPS. Its the lithiums that they're starting to say we shouldn't use due to voltage issues.

Man, that would really bum me out. They can be expensive. What kind of GPS was it?

So far I've never had a GPS unit failure. I've been surprized by dead batteries (thus the criticality of bringing spares), but even my old old Garmin GPS + is still working just fine.

Ken

I noticed that the Amazon price of the Garmin Colorado and Oregon have fallen quite a bit. I also had an opportunity to play with an Oregon 400t for a few weeks. The Oregon at least still has a MicroSD slot but at $460, I wouldn't call it budget friendly. If I ever get it finished, I'll post my thoughts on the Oregon.

IIRC even the lithium issue was fixed by firmware for Garmin so it seems it wasn;t anything permanently damaging.

Izzy,

Two eTrex failures taught me one thing. They do not like vibration. A 3 foot bounce off the pavement they can survive. Riding in my truck with constant but small road vibration does them in every time. If you think this might be part of the issue, see if it is possible to isolate it somewhat from the constant vibes.

the garmin lithium issue was the voltage was too high so the unit would shut down, so they checked and decided it wasn't too high and sent out firmware that made it do the safety shutdown at a higher voltage.

I remember reading about the screen issues too, IIRC was a connetor coming loose to the screen.

If anyone has a dead one they want to part with, I'd like one to disassemble and play with.

Just out of curiosity Izzy, how heavily do you rely on your GPS for maps and backtracking?

I still carry maps and tend to just use the GPS for occasional position fixes, but I know a lot of people who run theirs constantly to track their trail. A lot of the boaters I know use it for constantly keeping their course set.

Mine were not in use, they were thrown into the console of the truck and then used of site surveys and if I was hiking or whatever. If on some kind of vehicle mount, the is probably isolation enough.

Thanks for the answer Izzy.

Some of our uses are the same. I used to use the waypoints quite a bit to record discovered locations and features that were not on the maps, and then write them down in my notes and on the map itself.
I also used it for setting destinations from a map with a chain of waypoints to get there.

The most useful thing to me is still the ability to get an accurate position fix when I need it.

I try not to start relying on them too much because electronics always seem to fritz out on me just when they are needed the most.

Precisely, I was on a boat one time that the LORAN failed (yup, that long ago) and found out that nobody was really quite sure of where we were, had no charts and had no bearing compass.

That was my thought too, there is an empty spot in my instrument cluster I thought I'd mount one