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#212391 - 12/05/10 03:02 PM Battery selection, storage and chemistry
chaosmagnet Offline
Sheriff
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/03/09
Posts: 3819
Loc: USA
Battery availability has become an important topic for me, particularly for flashlights.

Part of the problem is that I've refused to standardize on a single type of cell for my flashlights. Different flashlights are for different circumstances and call for different cells. People who are less nuts for flashlights than I am would be well-advised to consider standardizing on a single type of cell. It would also be smart to consider availability of cells when standardizing.

One of the advantages of not standardizing is that whatever kind of battery I find, chances are I have a flashlight that will work with it.

Rechargeable batteries are great for heavy use, but most don't last long in storage. For emergencies, I prefer primary (not rechargeable) cells. Lithium batteries store for the longest time, endure temperature extremes well, and don't leak. Stay away from alkalines for emergency battery storage.

As for storage, my BOB has two hardshell cases, one holding 12 Energizer Lithium AAs and one holding 12 Titanium Innovations CR123As. The cases are http://www.batteryjunction.com/tpea-taacase.html and http://www.batteryjunction.com/tpea-tcr123acase.html (I have no affiliation with batteryjunction.com other than as a happy customer). Since my BOB sits in my car, weight and bulk are less important to me than they might be. I can always cache or discard equipment that I don't think I'll need, if I have to hoof it long distances.

For more mobile applications, I use a smaller case http://www.batteryjunction.com/ultrafire-cr123a-4-case.html. This one is in my CERT bag -- our CERT issues cheap dime-store D-cell incandescent lights. I carry mine to lend to someone, the flashlight I carry to use myself is CR123A powered. Since I'm the only one on my team using that battery, it behooves me to have spares in my bag.

During the workweek, I carry a single AA-cell flashlight in my laptop bag for use, and a AAA-cell flashlight for emergencies. There are two spare AAs (again, Energizer Lithiums, accept no substitutes) protected with a bit of scotch tape on each terminal. My laptop mouse also has a AA battery that I can repurpose for the flashlight, if I have to. The spare battery for my AAA flashlight is in another flashlight, that being the best way I could think of to carry a spare. There's also a single plastic-wrapped CR123A for my EDC flashlight.

Do you have enough spare batteries? Are they lithium primaries? How do you carry them?

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#212392 - 12/05/10 03:12 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: chaosmagnet]
Eugene Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 2995
The new (well not really new anymore) low self discharge NiMH I've tested leaving sit for a year and still have 90% run time, so I've gotten away from needing primaries except for secondary backups. I've standardized on AA's so I can scavenge from cameras or radios or whatever.

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#212396 - 12/05/10 04:25 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: chaosmagnet]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
I like AAA's because they mate with other electrical goodies I carry (weather radio and GPS). I too am a fan of the newer NiMH batteries. They save a ton of money over alkalines, which in my opinion are obsolete. I do prefer primary lithium batteries in items that will be stashed and used only intermittently. The appliances I tend to buy will accept any of these three types of batteries.
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Geezer in Chief

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#212398 - 12/05/10 05:34 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: chaosmagnet]
rebwa Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 295
I’ve been actually moving away from AA and AAA lithium’s as my collection of Eneloops expands. My Surefire lights take only lithiums and I tend to use them for emergency lights only, not for everyday things. As lithium batts are fairly expensive be it the Surefire batts or just lithium in AA or AAA.

I just picked up a couple more packs of Eneloops at Costco the other day and if you’re a member they are $4 off at the register now. Package includes a charger, 8-AA and 4 AAA for $21.95. These new Eneloops have been improved over the older white colored version in they hold a charge for up to 3 years and take a charge up to 1,500 times and are good down to I believe -20 . From everything I’ve read there isn’t much chance of leakage with the Eneloops.

However, lithium’s still have a place in my pack as they are very light in weight compared to the Eneloops.

I carry extra batts for the Surefire lights in the carrier's made by Surefire. The AAA and AA go in film canisters, prescription bottles or those zip lock's made for pills. Which method depends on if weight is a factor.

And I still keep plenty of regular copper tops on hand for a power outage to run lanterns, radio's etc. as they are fairly inexpensive to keep on hand. I've had power outages for 9 days here from storms. However, never leave them in devices as they will leak.


Edited by rebwa (12/05/10 05:40 PM)

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#212399 - 12/05/10 05:36 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: Eugene]
chaosmagnet Offline
Sheriff
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/03/09
Posts: 3819
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Eugene
The new (well not really new anymore) low self discharge NiMH I've tested leaving sit for a year and still have 90% run time, so I've gotten away from needing primaries except for secondary backups. I've standardized on AA's so I can scavenge from cameras or radios or whatever.


If you're going to standardize, AAs are my top choice for that reason. If a store carries any kind of batteries at all, they'll carry AAs. The low self-discharge NiMH batteries, like Sanyo Eneloops, are excellent without a doubt, and I use them. But I didn't want to invest in buying and maintaining a bunch of them for emergency use.

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#212401 - 12/05/10 05:38 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: hikermor]
chaosmagnet Offline
Sheriff
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/03/09
Posts: 3819
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: hikermor
The appliances I tend to buy will accept any of these three types of batteries.


I'm not aware of any mass-market AA or AAA-using device that won't take lithium primaries or NiMH rechargeables. Lithium rechargeables (like 10440s) are a different story.

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#212402 - 12/05/10 05:49 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: rebwa]
hikermor Offline
Geezer in Chief
Geezer

Registered: 08/26/06
Posts: 7705
Loc: southern Cal
Originally Posted By: rebwa

However, lithium’s still have a place in my pack as they are very light in weight compared to the Eneloops.


And I still keep plenty of regular copper tops on hand for a power outage to run lanterns, radio's etc. as they are fairly inexpensive to keep on hand. I've had power outages for 9 days here from storms. However, never leave them in devices as they will leak.


Lithium batteries are actually cheaper to use than alkalines. Consumers Reports (December 2009) compared the cost per shot of running various battery types in digital cameras. Lithium batteries were cheaper than alkalines, except for Costco alkalines purchased in bulk. Given that lithium batteries are lighter, work better in cold weather, and are essentially leakproof, I go for lithium batteres. The CR article didn't go into the cost per shot of NiMH rechargeable batteries, but if you do a little arithmetic, they would seem to be the cheapest of all. I am very careful about putting alkaline batteries into anything I value, primarily because of their propensity to leak.
_________________________
Geezer in Chief

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#212403 - 12/05/10 06:08 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: hikermor]
rebwa Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 295
Originally Posted By: hikermor
Originally Posted By: rebwa

However, lithium’s still have a place in my pack as they are very light in weight compared to the Eneloops.


And I still keep plenty of regular copper tops on hand for a power outage to run lanterns, radio's etc. as they are fairly inexpensive to keep on hand. I've had power outages for 9 days here from storms. However, never leave them in devices as they will leak.


Lithium batteries are actually cheaper to use than alkalines. Consumers Reports (December 2009) compared the cost per shot of running various battery types in digital cameras. Lithium batteries were cheaper than alkalines, except for Costco alkalines purchased in bulk. Given that lithium batteries are lighter, work better in cold weather, and are essentially leakproof, I go for lithium batteres. The CR article didn't go into the cost per shot of NiMH rechargeable batteries, but if you do a little arithmetic, they would seem to be the cheapest of all. I am very careful about putting alkaline batteries into anything I value, primarily because of their propensity to leak.


I never put alkalines in anything other than during a long term power outage then for a short duration, as I've had them leak and ruin a couple of devices. I buy mine at Costco and stock up when they have a coupon special which gives another couple of dollars off the already decent price.

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#212404 - 12/05/10 06:20 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: chaosmagnet]
Eugene Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 2995
Originally Posted By: chaosmagnet
Originally Posted By: Eugene
The new (well not really new anymore) low self discharge NiMH I've tested leaving sit for a year and still have 90% run time, so I've gotten away from needing primaries except for secondary backups. I've standardized on AA's so I can scavenge from cameras or radios or whatever.


If you're going to standardize, AAs are my top choice for that reason. If a store carries any kind of batteries at all, they'll carry AAs. The low self-discharge NiMH batteries, like Sanyo Eneloops, are excellent without a doubt, and I use them. But I didn't want to invest in buying and maintaining a bunch of them for emergency use.


You don't have to invest and maintain them, they are not really any more expensive than lithium and don't take any maintenance, though I do top them of when I pull out gear to test it. I don't believe in storing gear for years at a time, I pull everything out once or twice a year for checks.

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#212405 - 12/05/10 06:27 PM Re: Battery selection, storage and chemistry [Re: hikermor]
chaosmagnet Offline
Sheriff
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 12/03/09
Posts: 3819
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: hikermor

Lithium batteries are actually cheaper to use than alkalines.


That's most true, in my experience, for high power drain devices. In low power devices, alkalines are cheaper until you factor in leakage and possibly storage life.

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