The 2000 Ford Windstar is developing a severe case of body rot. The unibody is going fast, the on-board computer is getting senile, the repairs are jumping from $250 now and then to $450 every two months. It's time. We normally don't buy new cars, the Windstar is the first - and only - new vehicle I ever bought and I saved up enough cash to buy it outright but paid for it with Amex for the points in late 1999. Now I'm ready again to get a replavement mom mobile and something for me too. I have a 1997 Jeep Grand Cherokee and it's hanging in there but at over 200K miles and with a lot of hard use, I can't expect much more.

I hate cars, I hate car shopping, I hate managing cars, I hate everything about dealing with cars. I think of cars as a troublesome necessity of life - so that's why I am asking for some opinion here.

I think we're going to buy new again, at least the mom mobile. I'll be OK with my jeep until the wheels fall off and the tranny fails (again). We can make new mom moblile a once every 10 years habit, I guess. I have looked at the vehicles from GM and Chrysler, and they have some phenomenal deals - but I have to admit that I have little confidence that parts and service will be easy to obtain in the near future. GM just sold the Hummer division to a Chinese company, they are also selling Saturn and Opal. Chrysler is heading to Fiat...and who knows what else. I have to admit that these facts and others have put GM and Chrysler in a very negative light for me as a buyer with a 10 year ownership horizon.

I have been looking at the Subaru Forrester, The Honda Oddesy, and even the Toyota Scion B they are pretty darn good. I've driven the hybrid SUV's - not impressed at all compared to the Prius, a vehicle I really like (my father in law has one). We need to transport 3 of my own kids plus any random number of spare kids that end up coming along for the ride, so 3 rows of seating is a must. I wish they still made decent station wagons.

Anyway, if anyone wants to talk cars...this would be a great time for it. Should I consider the Chevy or the Chryler products at all? What do you think?

Now that we have 6 kids, we had to upgrade from one of those 2000 Windstars to a 2001 Chevy Astro. The Astro was the only thing short of a 12 passenger van that has seats for our 8 people without climbing over the seats to get in and out. It also has a skosh more cargo space. I do miss the second sliding door, though.

Still have the Windstar for the moment if you want to do a lateral move - 106k miles, runs good, anti-lock brake idiot light comes on randomly, power door locks and rear vent windows work when they feel like it.

Would have been nice to get the AWD version of the Astro for a BOV but that's twice as much drivetrain to break. I'm not too worried about parts, the aftermarket ought to be able to take care of that. A male in my family must work on his own car no matter what, so it's not like I'd ever take it to a dealer anyway - death before dishonor.

I have a hunch that the parts availability issue will not be the major problem some think it will be. I'm guessing that the after-market and subcontractor suppliers will be around to service the market demand, regardless of what GM does.

I say if you can get a bargain price on the vehicle you want, go for it.

But what do I know?

Honda was supposed to have a new V6 diesel in the Pilot and Odyssey this year which would have made them pretty perfect. Oh well, another diesel letdown. Been looking at the 2009 Forester myself. Everything looks good except the 4speed auto but it still gets very respectable mileage (20/26) so its not that big a deal. Of course, there's a six speed Forester diesel for sale in Europe that's supposed to be here in 2010 but I ain't holdin my breath.

For philosophical reasons the only American company I would look at is the Ford Motor Company. I'd take a close look at the Taurus X and the Flex. They offer 7 passenger seating. The Forester would be my hands down favorite, despite only seating five, if Subaru could convince themselves to get rid of the archaic 4-speed auto and replace it with a 6-speed auto. Even Ford managed to pull that off. Otherwise, it would most likely be a Toyota RAV4.

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2 cents

Ford is actually doing pretty well right now. In fact, Lincoln was the only car company this month that was in the green and Ford itself did better than Toyota, Honda, and Nissan. Their vehicles are getting much better as well, much less is the way of reported problems vs. vehicles from just a few years ago. If I was going to buy a vehicle from one of the "Detroit 3" right now, it would probably be a Ford.

With that said, Chrysler was just bought by Fiat and is being heavily restructured, so one could say they are slowly on their way back. GM just declared bankruptcy and has around 3 months to work it all out. With that said, GM will still be around as four core brands (Chevy, GMC, Buick, Caddy); they will just have less dealerships and less debt.

Finally, if either company does happen to disappear completely, the government put into place a "Warranty Support Program" that basically means your warranty will be carried over to a third party provider, allowing it to still be valid. Therefore, there is really no reason to worry about whether or not your warranty will be good.

From what I can gather, a lot has been put into place to ensure that the consumer will still be safe buying a Chrysler or GM product. Therefore, I would go for it, especially if what I wanted was from one of GM's core brands or Chrysler/Dodge.

On a side note, resale value is in the s***er no matter what you buy now, be it import or domestic. We bought a $45,000 lexus RX330 new in 2007. Today, with only 18,000 miles on it, it's worth about $25,000. So, we're talking $10,000 a year lost on a Lexus (with less than average mileage), which is supposed to have one of the best resale values out there. If you're going to buy something now it's best to either get rid of it within a year or hold onto it for a long time (saving for a new vehicle along the way.) It's not like it was a few years ago when you could buy something, hold onto it for a couple years, and then buy something new with a minimal loss.

I personally would not consider a GM or Chrysler right now. But there probably are good deals out there if price is what you're after. My worries are not so much about parts availability - somebody (3rd party) will pick up the slack (or most of it) - but more about convenience. With all the dealerships being closed getting your warrantee work done might well involve a significant drive to one of the dealers that is still open. As time goes on, more and more dealerships will probably close and it might get more inconvenient. So even if GM and Chrysler pull themselves out of bankruptcy, you can count on less convenient warrantee work (fewer places to go), unless you happen to live near a dealership that remains open for the length of your warrantee. And there is no guarantee that you will end up in that lucky situation.

You also have to remember that 3rd parties do not currently make each and every part that's in an automobile. So it may be a while until some parts are ramped up and become available from 3rd parties, if they ever are. 3rd parties will be handling parts that they can make a profit off of. The manufacturers stock more parts because they realize that you'd never buy another car from them again if you couldn't get parts for the current car you bought from them. 3rd parties won't have this customer-continuity thing hanging over them, so they'll concentrate on the more common and profitable parts.

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p.s. - So what GM and Chrysler were worried about - nobody would want to buy a car from a bankrupt company - is true in my case. But what they didn't understand is that I would not have bought a car from a company that should have been in bankruptcy and was artificially held out of that state by bailouts. For me, "bankruptcy" and "should have been in bankruptcy" are exactly the same thing. I wouldn't buy from either. So save the taxpayers money and do away with the ill-conceived bailout.
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Wait and see who buys Saturn. It's not one of the brands GM wants in the "good GM", but we've had nothing but good service from the Saturn Vue we have.

. . . or go back to Ford. I'm driving a Ford Ranger older than your Windstar with no thoughts of switching. At least with Ford you'll get a vehicle designed by an auto company and not a car designed for White House committee approval. . .

The parts & service for GM & Chrysler will likely be a non-issue. I have been a jeep owner for YEARS, and parts are never hard to come by. There are enough after-marktet makers that finding parts wont be a problem. As for warranty issues, Haertig may have a point; I'd do some investigating there.
My current Jeep is the first new vehicle I've ever owned,and it is about out of warranty (well, technically, it IS, as I well exceeded the mileage). I have yet to have an issue with it. But, that was something that they kept all along-simple design, easy to fix if broken (at least in the Wrangler models). Had I a choice now, I wouldnt give up my jeep, but, I would likely have gone with a more economical car as well.

Marty, I have given some more thought to your question. I was thinking you may want to consider a three vehicle option. It sounds crazy but work it over in your mind. First, look at what your DW needs for her daily use. It looks like her and three kids. Four passengers; total. Leave out the contingency of "random" passengers for now. I would stick with the smaller SUV/minivan option for her. Second, you have pretty much defined your direction. You will stick with the Jeep for now. However, a move to a quality used pickup or true frame-based SUV (think Nissan Xterra) is in your future. Third, the contingency option for more than 5 passengers needs to be dealt with. I would seriously consider a Ford Econoline van. They are a true multi-tasker. You will have room for an army if needed along with the capability to remove the seats and haul an army's worth of stuff. Also, you can camp in it if you desire. The van sounds expensive gas-wise, but when you are considering moving many people fuel efficiency gets left out of the equation IMHO. The UberVolksMover probably wouldn't see as much action as anticipated.

Feel free to disregard anything you want.

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