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#186856 - 10/29/09 07:51 PM Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake!
jay2 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 35
Loc: idaho
Or, are they prepared for your sake?
scary video, if you back country ski, winter camp, hike, or snowmobile, this is a wake up call! http://vimeo.com/6581009


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#186864 - 10/29/09 08:24 PM Re: Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake! [Re: jay2]
camerono Offline
Member

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 146
Excellent video. Thanks

just forwarded it to all of my backpacking friends.

Cameron
_________________________
Publishing seattlebackpackersmagazine.com

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#186874 - 10/30/09 12:49 AM Re: Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake! [Re: jay2]
litlefoot01 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/18/09
Posts: 25
Loc: NY
Wow that video was a wake up to me. thank GOD thay were
prepared.

litlefoot01
Live and let live

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#186886 - 10/30/09 02:34 AM Re: Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake! [Re: litlefoot01]
Susan Offline
Geezer

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 5163
Loc: W. WA
Just a couple of days ago, I heard about something called an avalanche air bag, intended for snowmobilers. It's apparently a closed (can be repacked), bright orange bag that you wear on your back, with an attached CO2 tank. When you realize you're in the path of an avalanche, you pull the trigger and the bag inflates, and it keeps you near the surface when you finally stop. A beacon is also highly recommended.

The gentleman said they have been around for years, but are quite expensive (~ $1000). He said if they were $300, he would buy one.

It was all news to me!

Sue

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#186910 - 10/30/09 07:04 AM Re: Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake! [Re: Susan]
MostlyHarmless Offline
Old Hand

Registered: 06/03/09
Posts: 982
Loc: Norway
Lots of gadgets and trinkets exist, but the most important message is: Don't get caught! That guy in the video was exceptionally lucky. Face it: If you're caught in an avalanche, you die. At the same time, miracles do happen, and using avalanche beacons is probably the best way to initiate miracles....


A lot of avalanche fatalities are blunt trauma, i.e. you are being mashed against trees, boulders and such. Even if you avoid that kind of injury, surviving under tons of concrete hard snow is going to be tough. If you ever have seen snow removal with heavy machinery you have a very good idea what snow will look like after an avalance - it is rock solid. Imagine that those machines dump their load on top of you, and no one knows where to look for you... You cannot move an inch, you may or may not be able to breathe... your mouth and nose may or may not be clogged with snow... If you're retreived within half an hour, chances are poor to fair (unless you're killed by severe trauma.) If you exceed half an hour chances are slim to non-existent.


That being said, the best "be found" equipment is radio beacons, avalanche probes and shovels. In a party, each beacon is set on "send" when in avalanche country. If the worst happens, the lucky ones switch to "receive" and search and dig like crazy.

The lung, ingenious flotation devices, inflatable air cushions, 30 feet of red avalanche string in a quick release bag (hopefully some part of the string stays afloat), reflective tags ... the list of possible gadgets is long. Some of these may work, at least in certain circumstances, but none can guarantee survival.

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#186923 - 10/30/09 12:47 PM Re: Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake! [Re: MostlyHarmless]
scafool Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 1534
Loc: Muskoka
There are a couple of comments I could make here. The big one is this.
To me the first rule of survival is to avoid putting yourself into a survival situation to start with.

These skiers were playing a dangerous game. Even though they knew the risk level was high they chose to ski down an avalanche slope and if their recovery effort had failed you can bet the local SAR unit would have been called out and expected to expose themselves to the same hazards.

We have these people getting lost and killed in avalanches every year. They can carry all the tricks they want with them but they are still knowingly placing themselves into danger.

The second comment is on the video itself.
You should have noticed how the snow broke up ahead of him and was moving. A lot of people think they can outrun an avalanche, but you usually can't because the whole slab you are on starts to move at once all together. When the avalanche starts these people are usually already in the middle of it.
_________________________
May set off to explore without any sense of direction or how to return.

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#186951 - 10/30/09 04:21 PM Re: Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake! [Re: scafool]
jay2 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 35
Loc: idaho
Another comment on the video. He was asked by the guide to run a diaganol cut, which is a fast angled test run on the top of the slope, and he didn't. It might have sent the slab down without him. At least that is the idea.

It is customary to run some snow tests before skiing the slopes. Ie. dig a pit, look for layers, test the stability on that aspect and angle of slope. Since it was a heli guided situation.. I assume all that was done by an experienced guide?

He was rescued by knowledgable, and capable people with in 4 minutes and 28 seconds, almost unbelievably fast!

People, practice with your safety equipment, please.


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#187068 - 10/31/09 04:13 PM Re: Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake! [Re: jay2]
Colourful Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 11/14/07
Posts: 87
Loc: Yukon
If you're the only skier with a shovel in the group, well, you hope they're good at digging with their hands...

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#187204 - 11/02/09 05:43 PM Re: Avalanche - prepare for your buddies sake! [Re: Colourful]
jay2 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 35
Loc: idaho
Skiers, and snowmobilers need to start refusing to recreate with untrained, unequipped "buddies." If they have a beacon, probe and shovel, that's just the first step. Now they need to become proficient with their tools. I have seen a noticable increase in the percentage of back country users who at least have the equipment, but the practice still seems to be limited at best.

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