Hang in there, Vermonters. I remember your state fondly. DB

Sadly, the Lamson knife factory is pretty much wiped out. Unfortunately they laid off 50 workers which to me is a sign that they won't be up and running again any time soon.

Two companies I am fond of 'Spartan Races", and "Peak Races" are HQ'd in Killington, VT and its been hammered. People that work for them and friends of the business near there have been able to update regularly on Facebook regarding the area surrounding their offices that are used annually for some of their hardest annual races.

its amazing how much damage there is there from flooding and being cut off. All the bridges and roads were destroyed. The only way into the area was a long, arduous hike.

If they laid them off due to the flooding, it will allow them to collect unemployment. The owners may intend to continue the business, but it isn't going to be immediately.

Sue

On the flip side -

Did Vermont not know Irene was coming? Did they take any steps at all to prepare?

I mean NC was in a prep-mode for a week before, had the EOC up and running well before the storm hit. FEMA had supplies pre-positioned at Fort Bragg ready to go. Private companies had extra clean up crews ready to rock. The power companies had extra crews in place to help out with damages.

You would think such a forward thinking, each to their abilites, each to their needs, the people come first type of place woulda been ready. (Yes, that was sarcasm)

JB, I've been thinking about how to respond to your attitude. Particularly with what I think was a jab at Burlington's reputed psuedomarxist tendencies, never minding that the Burlington area didn't see squat. In fact, I have to wonder if you are trying to start an argument with those words.

We were ready, as much as we could be. A lot of people were prepared for a repeat of at least this spring's flooding or the '73 flood which are 40-50 year events, which this was much worse than. This isn't quite as bad as the flood we had in the late 1920s, where some roads weren't repaired for four or five years. But this was still a once every 75-100 year flood.

The problem with Vermont, and any place that isn't flat, is that you have two places to build- valleys, and the sides of hills and mountains. Guess where it is easier to build- the valley. Which was made by a river. What had hit us was the loss of the bridges and the roads- and I'd invite anyone who thinks they can do better to please step up and develop a road or a bridge that can stand up to a flash flood where the river is 20 or so feet above flood stage, particularly when said bridge or road bed is still being repaired from damage three months earlier that was 12 feet or so above flood stage.

Now, you mentioned North Carolina and it's military resources. It must be real nice to live in a rich state that has more money, more territory, and several sizable military bases. The Vt Army Guard is still replacing equipment that they had transferred away from it or was combat lossed in their deployment to Afganistan, which ended back in early May. Most of our helo assets are on a ship in the Atlantic because they are coming back from Iraq, and the flight and ground crews got to New Jersey on Tuesday. The lack of highly mobile, high capacity vehilces hasn't helped, but we had Hummers and helos and pack horses almost everywhere within 72 hours of the storm passing.

But if you want to compare North Carolina, go up in the mountains, and drop most of a foot of rain in under 12 hours in those mountains. Particularly after they were "asked" to donate a fair chunk of their water and technical rescue capabilities for a metropolitian area a day's drive away. And keep the active duty military out of it, just the Guard, with only part of their equipment. I doubt they would fare much better, particularly after a previous flood on par with what we had back in May.

But the rain didn't drop into the mountains. Instead, North Carolina got clipped along the coast, where it can drain quickly and doesn't bottle up into tight rivers. I applaud your ability to compare apples and oranges.

So please, show us. Show us how to build a miracle bridge and have a perfect weather forecasts and how to find resources that don't exist. Because I don't think you can, and your sarcasm really isn't appreciated.

JB, I guess my question is "What, realistically, could have been done differently?" Even though they say it, you can't actually roll up the streets and pull towns and states off the map temporarily. We're talking water and wind damage to vast areas, right? Not a rock concert or broadway show that didn't get postponed?

JB, I've been to Vermont. It's beautiful, it's quaint, it has stupendous color in fall.

It's also nearly all up and down. Google 'Vermont scenery' and it will show you a ton of photos showing white homes and churches in small valleys, and the photos always seem to be taken from the top of one of the hills around the valley(s). The storm affect the whole state -- how far can you run when that much area is affected, and how fast?

I don't know a whole lot, but I do know that water runs downhill and sits in the lowest spot.

Just how would you suggest that the people move their homes?

How do the farmers move their barns in a few days? How many cows or sheep can you fit in the back of a pickup truck? How should they have saved their crops? Their haying had probably started, so how do they move all that? Where do they put it?

There was way too much water for sump pumps, so how do you get rid of it? It's already in the lowest areas, so where do you pump it to?

Entire homes and their contents are just gone. Whole sections of roads are gone. Bridges have just disappeared. They can't get into some places except with helicopters or on foot. Helicopters can't usually carry very much, backpacks even less -- do you have an alternative?

Maybe you watch too much television. In real life, problems like what has happened in Vermont don't get fixed in 30 or 60 minutes, minus commercial time.

Sue

Very good reply, IronRaven! Knowledge and logic always trumps the other stuff. DB

Regarding JB's post:

Being in this case a rather detached observer, at least in the geographic sense, it seems to me that most of the pre-Irene concern was about areas at or near the coast. There was some note of possible heavy rains, but from what I gathered, the main focus was on storm tides and flooding in low lying coastal areas. I recall much less warning and concern about upland and inland areas.

Since the storm, there has been much written about how predicting storm tracks has become quite accurate, but predicting storm intensity is still not very precise. Also, according to several others on this thread, Vermont sent a significant amount of resources to other states that were thought (pre-storm)to be at much greater risk. Hindsight is always 20/20.

Here's hoping Vermont recovers as quickly and as completely as possible.