DVDs for data storage

My wife has all these CDs full of digital photos in our fire safe. I got to thinking what a shame it is that we've never used the DVD burner on our computer, and figured that if we could save some space with storage of the photos...why not try it?

Tonight I got a pack of DVD+Rs. I also noticed that they sell DVD-Rs. I see now computers advertise DVD RW +/- drives, and I got to wondering if I got the right kind of DVDs for what I want to do.

Who can clue me in as to what the difference between the +/- is?
I got the DVD Rs because I wanted to make sure they work the way I think they will before I invest a little more in RW.

Thoughts?

Ors,

Here is a link for a website explaining information on various DVD formats, as well as other information, probably more than you need. <img src="/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Hope this helps.

Take care,

Stargazer

ASAP = Always Suspicious, Alwyas Prepared

Well, from a user's perspective, the only real difference between + and - is maximum speed. The + seems to burn a little faster. There may also be a price difference.

The - discs also can work on some older units that won't play the + discs. But since this is an emergency backup, buying a new $30 DVD drive would not be much of a big deal if the computer that you were trying to restore to could not read it.

BTW: You might want to re-think how you store those discs. Thy dyes on recordable discs change color based on heat. In the event that a fire safe has to stand up to a fire, the disc might not melt, but there still might be enough heat to ruin your data. You might also want to consider sending periodic copies of your discs to a trusted friend/relative who lives in a different part of the country.

**EDIT**
You might also want to consider a hard drive for backup. You can get a 2-1/2" hard drive in a USB enclosure. You plug this into your computer, and copy your files over. When done, unplug and put it in the safe. It would be rather large, but would allow you to keep 100 gigs in a box 1" x 4" x 5". If space is not a problem in your safe, you can store 500 gigs in a box less than 2" x 7" x 10".

I hadn't considered the possibility of data corruption due to heat...good point. I am also planning to put an extra copy in a safe deposit box. Hopefully between those two backups, at least one will survive. Maybe I need to include the discs as grab and go items...although in a fire I probably wouldn't be thinking about "stuff" while trying to get everyone out safely <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

As I've said before, I like the Star Trek philosophy of "triple redundancy" <img src="/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

BTW, thanks for the link stargazer...very informative!

I recently read an alarming article about how long a CD or DVD you can write yourself should last (Not factory-made CD's or DVD's such as music cd's).

Theoretically they should last up to several decades.
In reality they last about 2 to 5 years (max. 10) when using good quality media and proper storage.

The "R" (write once) => organic dye => degrading over time
The "RW" (rewritable) = > heat-sensitive cristals => degrades twice as fast as the "R"-kind

When buying cheap, you could end up buying old and already degraded stock or low quality, hence further reducing their usefull life.

I just want to warn "the good people at ets" to be carefull about storage. I'd hate to hear that people lost their precious photo's or other data due to degrading of CD's or DVD's.

The conculsion of the article:
- safest bet = (have them professionally printed) printing your digital photographs
- If you store on CD or DVD => migrate your data to new CD/DVD at least every 2 years.
- Alternatives such as external harddisks, tapes, flash memory are vulnerable too.

The only way to be sure (I hope)?
<img src="/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />- store a copy elsewhere (as stated above)
- migrate data to new optical media every 2? years
- keep/make prints
- store on external disk

All in all pretty cumbersome ...
I'm still in analogue "film" photography and am thinking about migrating to digital (slr). <img src="/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />Just don't know what the best strategy is to make sure my grandchildren can see photographs of their parents being kids. Kids are 2, 4 and 6.

Where's the time of the good old "silver prints" of the original black and white photography => they should last longest (or is this a myth to)?

This article was not from specialised press, just a local newspaper, so i don't know how reliable it is.

Hope some of you found it usefull.

Greetings

Hard drives are, in my humble opinion, the best option. You can throw an old HD in a USB enclosure and use it on any USB port. Hard drives last for years (I have one running at home right now that has been a main system drive for seven years). They simply age well. They either work great, or they tend to start to fail in spectacular ways which are easy to notice. In order to have extra security, you can get two of them.

Backing up your data is a continuous process, not a one-time event. So you should have no worries about keeping your data for the future. When USB starts to go the way of the dinosaur, you copy the data over to another hard drive connected to whatever the new external interface flavor is.

The real down side of hard drive storage is that the up-front cost can be sizable. If you already have a hard drive lying around, a USB enclosure is only $30 or so. If you are starting from scratch, a portable HD setup can run you around $100 each. So you can only practically have one or two of these. On the other hand, backing up your data requires no special software, and no special procedures. The cost of each backup drops down to a pennys worth of electricity.

DVDs and CDs are better for making a periodic backup that you stash away. Optical discs are easer to mail and store. However, they are less reliable and more trouble to make.

My plan involves a removable hard drive for local backup, and mailing DVDs to a relative in a different part of the country. The hard drive can be used every few days, or every week. DVD backup would be used every month.

Hard drives are not really any better than any other method.
A hdd can still get wiped/corrupted by virus/os crash/whatever while plugged in. Can get damaged by a surge while plugged in. Can be easily damaged by a drop while being carried or unplugged. Can fail whe stored in one of those firesafes from the heat.
The best method if to never rely on one type of media. Copy data to another hard disk and burn dvd's as well.

No one has mentioned this, but what about hosting the data online? There are several options like photobucket, imageshare, yahoophotos, etc. Any thoughts?

These services are only good for photos. Not so good for storing e-mail, budgets, tax returns, etc. This can be part of a back-up strategy, if you wish. But I prefer to keep all of my stuff lumped together as one unit. This makes it easier to keep track of.

I forget which online service it was, but back in the dot-com days, a friend stored all of his photos on one of these photo websites. Well, the website went bankrupt without warning and went offline one day, but they eventually offered to return them for a fee. He was not pleased. Definitely read the user agreement if you want to go this way to understand your rights.

I'd say that sites like these are great for sharing photos (don't have to email photo files to a bunch of people) but for long-term storage, better to keep the files under your control.

In case you didn't realize it, fire safes are generally only designed to prevent paper files from burning. I forget--how many hundred degrees for paper to ignite? I'm thinking of that book, Fahrenheit 451. Anything near that kind of temperature can warp and damage CD's.

Anyway, to protect computer media like CD's, floppies, DVD's, etc. the fire safe should explicitly say so. I'm not sure if there are any official standards. AFAIK, safe deposit boxes are not designed to protect computer media either, although the fire suppression systems and just the general environment inside of a vault make heat damage pretty unlikely.

My Internet Provider offers free disk space to store web pages, along with your Email account.
BUT, using this space to store data, photos etc... is strictly forbidden. Such data would be destroyed and the account closed.

It depends on the type of media that you are trying to protect.
Floppies, tape cartridges, vcr tapes, etc. are much more succeptable to heat damage than CD/DVD media or USB drives.

Sentry rated for digital media (low temp)



A large number of their safes are rated for CD/DVD storage for 1/2 hour.

Sentry household fire safes (high temp. digital media)

Sentry product testing descriptions

Sam's Clubs currently have a chest size (about 15" w, d & h) for about $50.

There's a wonderful metal box right near your house that protects your cd's from fire, earthquake, hurricane, riot, just about everything. It's maintained by the federal government. You don't have to pay any annual fee, just roughly 1 dollar each time you use it, on a pay-as-you-go basis. The box is called the mailbox. Just arrange with a friend in another state that you're going to send him a couple dvd's now and then so he can save them for you, in a box or empty 50-cd spindle with your name on it, and you'll do the same for him. Then you burn a disc once a month and send it to him and he sends his to you. Even if your whole town falls into a crevice (assuming you get out in one piece), hopefully he's far enough away that your data will still be ok. For ultra redundancy, do this with several friends who are widely dispersed.

You can also rent space in a local bank vault (safe deposit box) for 20-50 bucks a year. Those things are seriously fire protected.

See http://taobackup.com for some more backup strategy in the form of Zen parables.