Aviation PFD?

I finally got my private pilot license, and one of my intended destinations is Catalina. The club that I belong to has PFDs available but I would rather have my own.

The most recent article that I've found on ETS is from 1996, and I am pretty sure that the manufacturers have updated their products since then. I've seen a company called Revere that wasn't reviewed, but their PFD looks a lot like the Mustang, but looks don't mean much, so I am lost.

Any preference between manual and auto inflation?

I would normally just go with "what the vintners buy" and get the Switlik vest that Doug has, but I don't see anyone selling them.

Does anyone have a suggestion?

Thanks

Seth

Maybe this would work

Go with a manual system. To my knowledge the only auto inflation systems in aviation are used where a parachute will be the most likely mode of water entry. You definitely do not want your PFD inflating before you are clear of the aircraft.

Yes, but not on PFDs.Catalina island 'airport' is one I would put on hold until you have some hours in your log book and a few flights over with an experienced pilot.

here are a bunch of different PFD's this is what we use in the helicopters

http://www.sospenders.com/.

Have you flown there before?

Staying afloat is the least of your problems if you have to ditch between here and there. Hypothermia is a big threat. As you are crossing, you have to plan for an engine-out procedure just as you do over terra firma. Only, over water, you want to ditch in front of a boat if possible.

Anything that will keep you bobbing for less than half an hour will be fine. Wear an international orange hat.

This advice is for the specific SoCal to KAVX route in question.

Pat

p.s.: I didn't mean to reply to Izzy's post. I hit the wrong button.

Thanks for the advise.

I already replied to Chris K privately with this, but I'll repeat it publicly.

I "finally got" is as of May. I've heard about the difficulties of flying into AVX and have an instructor scheduled to go with me. We'll probably do a few take-offs and landings, and of course eat some buffalo burgers.

Also, everyone, thanks for the advise on the PFDs. I'm leaning to the Stearns Aviation vest, and loading it with equipment that I already own, including an ACR PLB, and pretty much duplicate Doug's vest.

Further comments will still be appreciated.

Thanks again.

Seth

Focus on the runway!

If you fly out of TOA, let me know before you go. You can bring me back a Buff-Burger.

Pat

There are a bunch of vests on the Steans website, but I couldn't find one labeled "Stearns Aviation vest". Do you have a direct link?

Russ

This is the least expensive that I saw.

http://www.westpacmarine.com/aviation/vests.asp

Seth

I'm flying out of EMT. Maybe another time.

Seth

Okay, the Stearns I like is the I650 Stearns® VR™ Versatile Rescue, mostly because it's set-up with webbing to take a helo hoist. The Stearns-SOSpenders Inflatable Nomex Vest you chose looks more comfortable (a good thing), but note that it's only authorized for use in aircraft that have no requirement. Does it have leg straps?

If I get one it will probably be the Switlik Special Operation Vest because of the purpose built pocket for a HEED bottle in addition to the gear pocket found on their Helo Crew Vest.

Please be aware, this PFD is not set up for helicopter hoist operations. The leg straps are primarily to hold it in place in swiftwater, where the power of the water can cause a PFD to rapidly rise up on the wearer. The quick release belt is for “live bait” rescues, where the rescuer is tethered, as the line plays out and become taut, the rushing water can over power the buoyancy of the PFD, forcing the rescuer under water. The quick release belt or “blow out” belt allows the rescuer to quickly disconnect from the tether. This PFD should only be used by trained individuals, as a Type 5 PFD, it is application specific.

Take a look at these PFDs:

PFD

Also consider a separate harness designed for wearing under a PFD:

CMC Harness

Pete

+10 on the CMC Rescue products. I learned of them from SWAT and Technical Rescue buddies. I then made some of their harnesses and rescue equipment standard on my tower crew's vehicles in the old job. Not only is their stuff top notch, it is comfortable (related to others) and service was second to none.

Live bait, whew . . .
Looks like those guys should have an extra buoyant PFD. Just to haul the weight of those big stones with them. That looks like a way to become dead bait. My hat is off to them!

Thanks for clarification on the I650 Stearns® VR™ Versatile Rescue vest. Looking at the webbing it seemed like it should be able to take a hoist especially with the Optional Auxiliary Tether System which attaches to either shoulder. The "Supports up to 1,100 lb. when properly integrated. . ." makes it seem ready for a helo hoist.

As I recall from the helo hoists I've done, all the weight was taken by that wide piece of webbing across the chest and the leg straps didn't do much. As you said, the leg straps just keep the vest from riding over your head.

Sounds like you are thinking about the "horse collar" type lifting strap. Having transited to and from more rotary wing aircraft than I can remember via a hoist/rappel/fast rope, I strongly suggest a proper harness. Failing the use of a harness then a properly tied "Swiss Seat". If you are looking for an all in one solution for PFD/Hoist they are mostly green in color and not 100% comfortable until you adjust to it. Mustang makes just one example. The hoist straps don't show in the picture, but they are there.

Good luck.

No, I was using a Navy aviation survival vest just like the one issued from my squadron paraloft. It had heavy nylon 1.75" webbing across the chest with a D-ring lift point @ center chest. The 1" leg straps would assist in keeping you in the vest, but I wouldn't trust them on their own.

I have used a horse collar, not nearly as secure as the vest.

The tether strap does not attach at the shoulder for hoisting. The quick release strap is threaded through the ring of the tether and is usually held in place at the wearer’s back with Velcro. The carabineer part then attaches to the shoulder (for this PFD, either shoulder) to keep it out of the way when not needed. When in actual use the carbineer is attached to a rescue line (i.e. throw bag line) for “live bait” rescues. The tether itself is elastic, for shock absorption. The vector forces on the quick release strap are designed for horizontal forces, i.e. rescuer in the water placing horizontal forces between the PFD and the rescue line. In a hoist scenario, the vector forces being applied to the PFD/quick release strap are vertical; the leg straps are not designed for supporting the full weight of the wearer in a vertical operation and may fail at the buckle. I can tell you from personal experience, with my PFD (Rescue PFD-for hoist operations, I use the CMC SRT Harness underneath)and being pulled into an inflatable boat, by the shoulders of the PFD, it rides up, even when properly fitted, I can not imagine attaching any part of it, including the quick release strap for a hoist operation. A PFD designed for or in conjunction with a rated harness should only be used for a hoist operation.

I do not consider myself an “expert” in anything, but in matters of water rescue and hoist operations; I am somewhat “experienced”.

Pete

Trouble with this hoist stuff is that while I remember it like it was yesterday, it was many years ago and much of the equipment I used has been phased out/replaced with new-better. The idea of using a good PFD with a serious harness such as the CMC SRT Harness is appealing. My old survival vest would do both; I may look at the current mil issue gear.

While a variety of things can or may work or be jury-rigged to work, schaz is making an initial purchase of a PFD for aviation applications. Since his life may depend upon selecting the appropriate PFD, he should purchase the very best he can afford. This one survival product on which one should not make any compromises, your life may depend upon it working and working correctly.

Pete

I thought an airplane PFD was a parachute? :->

Try to remember that when the wind changes and you end up in the water under your canopy and are loaded with your body weight in gear. As the parachute is dragging you under think back to this post. BTW, if you can get out from under the canopy and away from the shroud lines, loose all the gear except that the gear that goes bang. Loose too much gear and the paperwork is annoying. Don't loose enough, and you get to meet the divers. Well not meet, but they get to "meet" you.

Yep, once you're in the water a parachute is a liability. One horror story has a Navy pilot eject at low altitude and enter the water near the aircraft he just got out of which was sinking quickly. His parachute was snagged by the plane and he couldn't release the parachute from his harness. His body was not recovered.

I was amazed how much that piece of nylon weighed. Thank goodness it was a training environment, and the water wasn't deep. I had a nice lunch with the divers that got the weapon off the bottom for me also. The price beat the heck out of the paperwork for CID and all that.